question

tobe91 avatar image
tobe91 asked

Orion XS input voltage compensation

Hello,

I thought about replacing my Votronic VCC1212-50 booster in my Camper van with an Orion XS 50A.

From what I currently understand the Orion doesn't measure input voltage separately from the main 12v input coming from the starter battery?

Like in the most installations there is at least 4m or more cable between starter battery and the Orion XS. This ends up in a considerable voltage drop and affects the charging efficiency quite strong.

I'm using the Victron SmartShunt where I have the starter battery voltage on the Auxiliary Measurement port of the SmartShunt.

Wouldn't it be possible to forward this information anyhow to the Orion XS to compensate for the voltage drop? So no separate connections would be needed.

Thanks, Tobias

orion xsvoltage drop
2 |3000
Toggle Comment visibility. Current Visibility: Viewable by all users

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

2 Answers
Matthias Lange - DE avatar image
Matthias Lange - DE answered ·

As far as I know is Victron working on a software solution for that.

You enter the cable length and cross section and the Orion can calculate the voltage drop.

1 comment
2 |3000
Toggle Comment visibility. Current Visibility: Viewable by all users

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

tobe91 avatar image tobe91 commented ·

This sounds really weird from my perspective, topics like cable ambient temperatures and so will all influence the calculations.

This has a smell of that they designed something and forgot something essential and now try to come up with a cheap solution to overcome this.

Why not just use what is already there with the SmartShunt or BatterySense, used by many customers? This would enable a precise information and not something error prone.

0 Likes 0 ·
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) avatar image
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) answered ·

Hi @Tobe91,

The Orion XS supports receiving battery voltage via a Smart Battery Sense, or SmartShunt via a VE.Smart Network (over bluetooth).

For more info on how to set that up please see the VE.Smart Network manual here - https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/VE.Smart_Networking/en/ve-smart-networking-product-compatibility.html

10 comments
2 |3000
Toggle Comment visibility. Current Visibility: Viewable by all users

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

tobe91 avatar image tobe91 commented ·

I read this instruction already, but from what I read the Orion XS only receives the voltage of the battery which it should charge and not the voltage from the vans starter battery or? So the input voltage measurement for the Orion XS is not doable via VE Smart Networking or?

0 Likes 0 ·
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) avatar image Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) ♦♦ tobe91 commented ·

I think I might have misunderstood your question,

What is the relevance of the input voltage drop?

A precise battery voltage reading is quite important for charging a battery, but the input is necessary to see if the alternator is running and doesn’t need to be exact.

0 Likes 0 ·
tobe91 avatar image tobe91 Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) ♦♦ commented ·

This topic is coming up regarding the Camper Vans with EU6 emissions. The smart alternator is not all time running at maximum voltage or at least quite seldom.

So it will often just run at about 12,5V or so. So if we have about 5-6m cables we have easily a drop of 0.5V or more volts, which will result in quite low voltage at the Orion XS main input terminals and it will start lowering the charge current even if it shouldn't.

There are already many videos out where they are comparing the Votronic VCC-1212-50 with the Orion XS and there is a significant lower charging current at the Orion XS in comparsion with the Votronic.

0 Likes 0 ·
Jeremy Albrecht avatar image Jeremy Albrecht tobe91 commented ·

I’m having a similar, but to a worse level, issue in my setup. I’m charging batteries in a trailer from the dual alternators of my truck. They’re a smart system so they don’t always run at full output capacity. Combine that with a 25’ run of 2AWG wiring and the voltage drop when the Orion is charging puts the incoming voltage at the Orion end at about 12.8v. This means that if I have engine shutdown detection turned on I have to lower the voltage setting very low (to 12.75v) and even then the Orion ramps down its draw and I end up with only about 550w output. I can’t set the shutdown detection voltage any lower as the actual voltage it sees when the engine is shut down is about 12.71. If I disable shutdown detection then I get the full power out of the Orion no problem. Of course, then it won’t turn off.

0 Likes 0 ·
tobe91 avatar image tobe91 Jeremy Albrecht commented ·

Yes could be easily compensated/prevented if there is some possibility to pass-through the correct voltage of the starter battery/alternator to Orion XS. Almost every other B2B booster on the market is doing it this way.

0 Likes 0 ·
Show more comments
chrigu avatar image chrigu Jeremy Albrecht commented ·
Victron Toolkit suggests at least 70mm2/AWG00 for a 15m/50' (25' to and 25' back) run at 50A/14V. It still drops 0.4V, so using 95mm2/AWG000 would be better, still dropping 0.3V


But yes, it would be nice to pair a SmartBatterySense as the input sensor, not output

0 Likes 0 ·
Show more comments

Related Resources

Orion XS product page

Orion XS datasheet

Orion XS manual (html)

__________

Additional resources still need to be added for this topic