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richardvv avatar image
richardvv asked

Multiplus II With Pylontech US5000 ESS, First power on fails

Hi all,

I'm writing this because i think i have tried all i can, and have currently no more idea's in things i can check, still i am unable to power on the system.

I have been using this guide for the Pylontech ESS and Battey settings :

https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom

The errors i have are :

  • Breaker trips
  • Low Battery Alarm
  • Internal Failure Alarm

I have a Multiplus II 48/8000 with 4 Pylontech US5000 , The system is connected to 230Volt 25A Breaker, i'm only using AC-IN currently, the PV (Enphase) is AC Coupled and connected to the AC-IN

I have configured the Multiplus using (Remote) VE-Configre and loaded the ESS Assistant, which is set with settings from the above Pylontech page.


Power on failure

I have limited the AC-IN to 25A (Devicelist->Inverter-> Input Current Limit) and also set the max power to 5500W (Settings->ESS->Max Inverter Power) but when i poweron the Multiplus with the DC Batteries connected the breaker trips when the Multiplus goes to Charger mode, however it does start when the DC Batteries are not connected, but Low battery LED is on.

I have check the VEConfigure file multiple times and see no errors i may have made.

The GX (FW 3.40) detects the batteries als Pylontech with the settings shown, also the DVCC is enabled automatic, It reports the batteries as 48% SOC , 49.31V , -0.2A, -9W , Lowest Cell 3.282V Highest Cell 3.293V

2 Of the Batteries display the RUN LED blinking Idle (4sec) all SOC LED's are Off
2 Of the Batteries display the RUN LED blinking Discharge (2sec) Left 3 SOC Led's are On

I may have fixed the Interal Failure Alarm, one of the batteries had a DIP swich down, happend i think while installing. Although i'm not convinced this had any influance, because i have tried the system also with 1 or 2 batteries, where this batterij was excluded.

I have tried to limit the Charge Current, and Charge Voltage just above the reported Battery voltage, but to no avail.

I have kept the batteries connected as a set without the Multiplus or the CAN bus cable multiple hours and a night.


So currently my main focus is why the Multiplus trips the 25A breaker when starting with the DC connected. currently i ave no idea what to check or change.

If there are any details needs please let me know which and i will supply them.

Thank you.

Multiplus-IIPylontechenphasebatterie us5000
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10 Answers
Duivert NL avatar image
Duivert NL answered ·

Hi i dont have a direct answer, but why 8k inverter on a 25A breaker, thats way to small

Also if your ac limit is 25A its too high, the 5500W max power is too high also

anything that is slightly over can trip the 25A breaker

25A is 5750W max


Are u sure phase and neutral are correctly wired?

Did you turn off the enphase inverter on ac in, and tested it then?

(Multiplus and the pv inverter on 1 25A is also too much)

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richardvv avatar image richardvv commented ·

Yes i know the 25A is to low for the 8000VA inverter, but it was bought for future upgrade, currently the cable is rated for 25A.

Also i chose the 8000VA because of the 1:1 rule, my Max PV is currently 5760VA ,which i may expand in future, and i plan to connect that to the AC-OUT

The PV is is connected on its own breakers (2x16A in this case) and would go to Inverter trough the 25A breaker. (The 25A breaker only protects the Inverter)

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Alexandra avatar image
Alexandra answered ·

@Richardvv

The settings in ESS like limit inverter power have no influence when in charger only mode.

You need to set the input current limit down to under 25A (so 20A or less) to prevent the tripping on the AC breaker.

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richardvv avatar image richardvv commented ·

I will try setting the limit lower and see what happens. i think i tried it but have done so many think i cant remember.

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richardvv avatar image
richardvv answered ·

Just and update,

As suggested i check all cables again, I lowered the input current limit to 20A i set the ESS Power to 4000W, i override the DVCC Charge current to 10A (was 50A) i enable the DC batteries and only connected 2 Batteries (2 with SOC 3 LEDS) it reports 44% SOC in the GX. I Also have shutdown the Enphase PV just to be sure.

I Powered on the Inverter and the fuse blows when the inverter switches to Charge mode.

The Inverter also keeps reporting Low Battery, which is still don't understand.

Thanks for all the help.

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Alexandra avatar image Alexandra ♦ commented ·

@Richardvv

You now have two conflicting things - limit input power and limit invert power.

What happens now when the power is over the 4000W? It has to draw from somewhere.

In charger only mode of the load is above 20A it will just pass through and pull what it needs.

Still sounds like either you have a kak connection to batteries or undersized cable or something. Low battery on the inverter can be low voltage in ess assistant or a massive volt drop over cables.

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lifeingalicia avatar image
lifeingalicia answered ·

Did you limit in Ve config?

1721637842299.png


1721637842299.png (25.8 KiB)
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anacrhy2007 avatar image anacrhy2007 commented ·

One of the issues sounds to me like the BMS shutting down or worst case maybe damaged. When the battery BMS turns off you will get a "low battery" alarm as well as the RUN LED flashing with no SOC LEDs on the Pyltontech.

Pylontech charge voltages should be
52VDC Bulk (Absorption)
51VDC Float

Low battery cut off should be 45VDC and low battery alarm between 46 & 48VDC depending.

At 56.80 the Pylontech BMS will turn off. I know it claims differently in the datasheet, but believe me I have had few run-ins with Pylontech. The US5000 is a lower quality battery than the UP3000)

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lifeingalicia avatar image
lifeingalicia answered ·

enable weak AC

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richardvv avatar image
richardvv answered ·

I have change as suggested the Charge Current under the Charge TAB, and set the Weak AC enabled.

I'm unable to paste pictures, but the Charge TAB displays :

  • Weak AC : ON
  • Lithium Batt. ON
  • Charge curve FIXED
  • Absorbtion : 52Volt
  • Float : 51Volt
  • Charge Current : 5A

The breaker still trips when switching to charge.

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richardvv avatar image
richardvv answered ·

Another update,

I have the inverter online now with 1 Pylontech battery, With all batteries on the 47% SOC reported was to much for the breaker i guess.

The problem i now have is that the battery goes into Internal Failure, and lowering the DVCC Charge Voltage does not seem to help.

Keeping the system on for 3 hours also does not seem to improve the SOC, wich even seems to decline and is at 43% now.

I'm trying to charge the batteries but that does not seem to happen, with the GX Baattery page reporting

  • Battery modules : 0 Online / 0 Offline
  • Nr. of modules blocking charge / discharge : 1/1

Anyone know a way to get the batteries charging ?

With a battery voltage of 49.3V I have tried all 1V steps from 52V down to 44Volt
it also happens with any one of the 4 batteries.

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nickdb avatar image nickdb ♦♦ commented ·

It is best to stop fiddling with the system, set it up as per the docs and leave it on "keep batteries charged" for an extended period. It should resolve itself.

You can also consider powering everything off, including the battery, and doing a clean restart.

The BMS is blocking charge, this could be normal, it could be a fault. If you have concerns, Pylontech support are the people to speak to, or your supplier.

If you search here, you will find a few articles on the internal failure event from the BMS. It is outside of the Victron system's control.

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lifeingalicia avatar image
lifeingalicia answered ·

Hi

sorry did not read this

2 Of the Batteries display the RUN LED blinking Idle (4sec) all SOC LED's are Off
2 Of the Batteries display the RUN LED blinking Discharge (2sec) Left 3 SOC Led's are On

If I recall this is when the bat balances... did you balance the batteries?

Double check all cabling Double check all settings incl DVCC on etc... external CT?

Update all connected units to the latest Firmware

The max charge current of a US5000C is 80A should not trip

nickdb commented · 4 hours ago

It is best to stop fiddling with the system, set it up as per the docs and leave it on "keep batteries charged" for an extended period. It should resolve itself.

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daza avatar image
daza answered ·

@Richardvv it shouldn't be run without the batteries wired to it, are you in the UK? Are you using RCBO's of MCB? I found that i had to use an MCB i later got a time delay RCD for the whole house which now does not trip when the multiplus 2 does its earth check of first start. Hope this helps and PS a lot of RCBO's are not bidirectional so please make sure of this. But may be worthwhile to consult an electrician

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daza avatar image
daza answered ·

@Richardvv OP turn off weak grid shouldn‘t be using that if the grid isn’t weak, dont do any of the setting on that page unless you are limiting the AC input Current. What is best is blank slating the multi to default and then going from there, ESS should do all the setting for the batteries and follow the settings for the pylontechs just finished setting up on my 10000KVA follow the settings to the letter and DVCC will do they rest hope that helps. looked through the new bits of thread and you are running 25amps the multi’s start at a 50amp limit from the 5000’s if im correct so you will need to hard limit it on either grid or inverter page i cant remember but youll see it there and disable the over ride remotely having it enabled just asking for trouble IMHO as you won’t need to change that till you upgrade and at that point might your going to need to do tte assistance as your increasing your PV size. PS make sure you plug back in the VE cable as it wont see the batteries and will just show low battery alarm on the multi, and disconnect the MK3 after use https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom

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