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isolated system with quattro8k, AC and DC coupled chargers.freq shifting from 50.5-52.5hz,off at 53hz.(SMA inverters).at end of day freq stays stuck at 52.7hz through the night, failing to reset to 50hz, battery voltage is now 49,1V 82% SOC. turning on the generator resets the freq, but this is no real solution.suggestions?
just checked the settings,freqshift is from 50.2 till 52.7 float 55.2V
Use equalization (tubular plate traction battery curve) unchecked
Charge curve Adaptive + BatterySafe
Absorption voltage 57.60 V
Float voltage 55.20 V
Charge current 110 A
batteries 24x 2V 1500Ah C10, AC coupled sma tl4000, sb4.0 (limit to 3k) , DC coupled: bluesolar 150/60, 3x makeskyblue 30, 40A modified, venus, BMV700, quattro 8K, 55V automatic fans, battery, room airconditioning at 20degrC
according to the PV assistant the freq should reset at 5.2V below float, or in my case 55.2-5.2= 50V.
still at 49.1V , no reset..
Hi @basreflex, can you please first upgrade your inverter to the latest firmware?
Hi @basreflex
Please read this:
https://www.victronenergy.com/live/updating_firmware:updating_ve.bus_products
If you don't have the equipment or don't feel sure about doing this, ask your installer to update the firmware for you.
@basreflex
Did you manage to get this issue resolved?
I have the same problem with a Quattro 10 and it appears to have started when I upgraded the firmware from 417 to 460 and the PV assistant.
so it's not the firmware, that I did not upgrade yet to. there is another problem in the assistant : when the system is in 52.7 mode throttling the AC coupled power, there is no mechanism to release that power when needed. I had a few temp shutdowns for overload, while the freq was at 52.7 and the quattro was not able to release more power from the ac coupled inverters, as it only can reset the freq based on battery voltage. this is a design flaw that can be improved. the ac coupled regulation technique is quite crappy if you look at the AC voltage amplitude oscillations, when in ac coupled battery charge mode
I have observed similar behavior on a 5kVA Phoenix inverter with AC-coupled PV inverters.
The frequency sticks at 52.7 Hz, until I manually switch the inverter on and off, then it start again at 50Hz allowing the Pv inverters to restart.
I would also like to see a solution to this.
Hi @Peter-ZMG @basreflex @Phil_Gavin
Did you read this information:
if you believe this is not the reason in your system, what is the site's VRM identifier?
Thanks for that reference.
This part of my system is not on VRM, unfortunately.
I now believe the issue is that due to other charging apparatus the required low voltage threshold is not reached. I export back to the grid through quattro's on the same battery bank and there are also 3rd party MPPTs on the bank.
This all props up the lower voltage threshold that the batteries reach during the day.
However, adjusting the float voltage higher, or calling the batteries "lithium" may just fool the system into attempting to reset after a frequency shutdown earlier in the day.
Hi @Phil_Gavin
You could set the Quattro charge voltages lower, thereby exporting more power to the grid.
Off course somehow the batteries have to be fully charged also, so maybe a short absorption time followed by a lower float voltage to force feed-in?
yes I know this , and my system has not obeyed these rules set forth in the FAQ. there is a SW bug somewhere..
Hi @basreflex
I'd like to help, but without more information I cannot do much.
Is the system online?
yes the system is online ,incl remote console, except i'm on business travel .if the system fails the misses will change the door locks so please be careful. vrmid
985dadcb8ae4
Hi @basreflex
don't worry, we only change settings when the users allow us.
Looking at the system:
-frequency shifting seems to work fine the last weeks, (i see august 4 it got stuck) but:
-you're on very old firmware (Quattro: 413), newer firmware for your Quattro has lot's of upgrades, among others for better handling of high temperature events. the newer Venus firmware also has lot's of updates.
-the PV inverter is configured as 'on input 1' while I suspect it is connected to the output of the Quattro?
Before we give more support we always ask to updat to the latest firmware, if problems persist then we can look into the system from support to help fix any problems.
indeed the inverters are on the output, as they are located further away.
there is one SB4.0with 4kW on 192.168.2.210,another SB4000-tl21has 2kWpanels and does not showup. I did not see any remarks on frequency shift improvements in the firmware updates ,that is why I have not yet upgraded.. should be easier now..
Hi Daniel,
System is online, 985dad367a45
Your help would be much appreciated
regards Peter
Hi @Peter-ZMG
What is the problem with this system?
Hi @Peter-ZMG
When did this last happen?
screenshot is 'yesterday' and everything worked fine then
I did notice an AC in event at 17:13:
but the frequency was already ramping down then before the ac-in came on.
It was 2 or 3 days prior, I cannot be sure. It does not happen every time. Yesterday was me intervening, I switched in the grid for 1 minute to reset the frequency as SOC was diving.
Also i should say that I am using an 'Amber control' device to switch in a high load to utilise the excess solar energy which runs for approx 5 mins in the event that the frequency reaches 50.25hz-50.5hz, to avoid switching off the solar inverters at 100% SOC. I will try a greater load as a test, although it is currently set at approx 7Kw.
Hi @Peter-ZMG
Ok, I think you intervened too fast in that case.
Can you drop a message when the system get's 'stuck' (please don't intervene then) so I can have a look at it?
Please mention my name (@...) so I get a message.
Hi @Daniël Boekel ,
Ok Daniel, I will do that, although it seems only to happen when we have very high light levels, so it may not happen before the weekend, as it is cloudy today and solar input is low.
I have also been looking at the 'Relays' assistant and think there may be a better control of the 100% SOC event handling available either using SOC or voltage, (or both), as the trigger.
Sorry about the 'addressing' issue, I hope I have it right this time
Hi @Peter-ZMG
Ok noted, thanks, I'm looking into it (read: asking people more smart than me)
Hi @Peter-ZMG
I checked into your system, and the last 7 days it seems to work well?
Did you change anything?
@Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff)
Hi Daniel, Yes, the system does not overload and shut down, but it is not doing what I expected it to do and that is cancelling out the significant benefits I gain by not allowing the Quattro to shut down the solar inverters, when the battery is fully charged.
I do this by using a frequency switch, (currently set to operate at 50.25Hz), to switch a relay to engage up to 3 * 3Kw immersion heaters in water heating buffer tanks. When this happens, all the solar energy is diverted to this and there should not be any available for battery charging and the Quattro should return to 50Hz. The shut off of the frequency switch is on a variable delay, (currently set to approx 3 minutes), to avoid constant switching at times of high sun. The objective is to hold the battery level close to 100% for as long as possible, to provide max battery power which will last over night. This delay timer will only start the countdown once frequency has fallen to 50Hz.
In recent days the Quattro has shut down the solar inverters, even though there is no charge happening and with loads of 6Kw+ allowed the battery to drop to 80%, or less, before it reduces the frequency to 50Hz. This defeats the object, as it then recharges to recover the lost 20%, which will not happen if it is later in the day.
I have made one change in the last few days, but it does not seem to affect anything…
As I have updated to the latest firmware on the VenusGX and the Quattro, I have removed the 4 wire battery control on the BYD B-Box, and now just rely on the Can-Bus connection to control it. I saw this suggestion on a response from 'BYD Service' on the Byd thread.
As I mentioned before, perhaps I should consider using Battery SOC to switch in the extra loads, so that it could happen, say, ‘on’ at 99% and ‘off’ at 97%. Thus not allowing the Quattro to need to ever alter the frequency, except if the extra load failed.
It is definitely worth pursuing as when working as planned and on good light days I can get 10-20% extra from the solar inverters.
Your comments on this proposal would be appreciated.
