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ningaloo avatar image
ningaloo asked

Can I add a generic (Chinese) PWM to my existing 2 x SmartSolar MPPT installation?

I have a small installation on a boat in the Mediterranean.

2 x 120W panels into 100/30 MPPT and 2 x 80W panels into 75/15 MPPT.

I have now purchased a (cheap) solar mat. Advertised as 300W but I'm guessing 100W is more realistic. This is primarily to (slowly) charge a lithium 48V battery for an ePropulsion motor which comes with its own 48V MPPT controller.

I am wondering if I can connect the PWM controller supplied with the solar mat to my existing installation to supplement charging my 3 x 160Ah 12V house bank?

The PMW appears to supply 13.8V to the battery whereas the Victron MPPT are currently reporting about 13.2V in bulk mode which is approximately the battery voltage reported by my SmartShunt.


Solar Panel
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6 Answers
kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

Sounds as if your solar installation is not keeping up with demand.

The mat PWM might help if connected to the batteries.

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ningaloo avatar image
ningaloo answered ·

When I am at anchor the solar will keep up with demand. Two days ago I generated 1.6kw and consumed 1.2kw. However when I sail I use more power (instruments and autopilot) plus the sails often block the sun from my panel so yesterday the situation was reversed with 1.7kw consumed and only 1.2kw generated.

Having said this, although my batteries get to 13.8V and the SmartShunt calculates 100% SOC, the solar panel MPPTs very rarely get into absorption mode, let alone float. This usually only occurs if I use the engine a fair bit, or get shore power. Is this going to cause battery degradation in the long term?

My question is really about the charging algorithm that the Victron MPPT use and if this will be messed up by adding the PMW to the battery given that the PMW is supplying a higher current (13.8A) than the MPPT when in bulk mode. I find that in bulk mode the MPPT supply lots of amps but the voltage is at or very slightly above the battery voltage. Is this expected?

I have only just got my Raspberry Pi Cerbo installed (after it sitting in my project box for over a year) and I'm beginning to get a clearer picture of both demand and solar supply.

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ningaloo avatar image
ningaloo answered ·

Update: I was reading the details from the PMW incorrectly. 13.8V is the float voltage and not the supply voltage.
I have added the PMW to the batteries and it appears to be reducing the load / increasing the charge on the system.

I'd still appreciate comments on my questions relating to the MPPT not going into absorption mode.

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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

In general undercharging LiFePO4 will do no damage. However they need to be fully charged at regular intervals so that the BMS can equalise/balance the cells in the battery. This frequency you should check with the battery maker specs. AGM, which I think your house bank is, will be damaged very quickly by undercharging.

You should be reaching over 14 Volts, battery dependant, probably between 14.2 and 14.6V, again dependant on makers specs.

MPPT not going into absorption is because your panels are too small. So battery voltage is not rising high enough as it charges to kick the MPPT into absorption.

Smart shunt SOC can be very accurate, if parameters set correctly. I suspect this isn't the case. If incorrect, or not suitable for local conditions, it can synch to 100% wrongly. There's a good video on the Victron YouTube channel about tweaking these settings. In essence the SOC synchronises to 100% when charged voltage is reached and current drops to the tail current setting for the detection period. Clouds/shading can trick the shunt. Suggest you check and set charged voltage to absorption, or very slightly below, tail current down from 4% to 2% or less and increase detection time to 10 minutes or more.

Normal values for AGM are approx 14.4V absorption, 13.7 float and off charge will drop to and maintain about 12.6V fully charged. Will drop due to self discharge over following days, but overnight with no load, you should stay at or over 12.6V. these voltages are for 25C, will reduce as temperature rises.

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ningaloo avatar image ningaloo commented ·
Thanks for your help. My batteries are AGM. I had previously attempted to understand SOC and increased charged voltage from 13.2 to 13.6 a little while ago. I have now set SOC charged voltage to 13.6 and have increased time interval to 10 minutes (was 4) and reduced tail current from 4% to 2%. Still learning!!!


My last boat had similar setup and the AGM batteries were just beginning to show reduced capacity after 6 years, however I am now spending most of my time at anchor rather than in a marina with shore power but I do have more solar.

Of course the other input is the engine which will be used for an hour or so when manouvre to and from anchorages and sometimes for more extensive periods when there is no wind.

You are suggesting that not getting the batteries to 14V (absorption) will damage them and I am anxious to prevent this. I very rarely (if ever) see battery voltage less than 12.6 and had previously believed that getting them to 13.8 most days was sufficient to preserve health.

Do you think that on days when I don't get to 14V I should supplement charging by running the engine? I tend to only of this when bulk charging is required as I know that the charge rate declines as battery voltage increases. My alternator is rated 125A but if course the battery only takes a fraction of this.


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kevgermany avatar image kevgermany ♦♦ ningaloo commented ·
Rule of thumb is that AGM is about 80-85% charged when it reaches absorption voltage. It needs to get there and remain in there for long enough to fully charge and prevent sulphation.

By only charging up to float, the batteries are not charged fully and will have a shorter life.

Must find out why solar isn't getting to the right voltage. As you say the MPPTs are always in bulk at low voltage, it points to insufficient PV. Could be cabling, dirty panels, shading...


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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

Maybe this helps, it's a whole day, yesterday, from my camper. System is 24V, so I've adjusted volts accordingly. Solar only at present.

There's a fridge and fan running continuously, but overnight voltage dropped to about 12.5 due to load/heat. As soon as solar kicked in battery voltage went up to about 14.3. this was maintained as the batteries charged, you can see current dropping quickly, then there's a second voltage drop as the MPPT switched to float. Once sun disappeared, voltage dropped as expected, but was maintained by the batteries despite the load. screenshot-2022-07-25-10-30-06-811-orgmozillafiref.jpg


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ningaloo avatar image ningaloo commented ·

What size panels do you have? My system shows about 50ah used (mostly fridge) overnight which takes until midday (at least) to recover.

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kevgermany avatar image kevgermany ♦♦ ningaloo commented ·
2*300
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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

Another thought. What are the battery settings in the MPPTs?

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