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edvinerikssonjohanssonctk avatar image
edvinerikssonjohanssonctk asked

Phoenix Inverter 12 V DC | 375 VA bypass security shut-offs

Hi,

I am currently powering a Phoenix Inverter 12 V DC to 230 V AC with a bike generator and using a large capacitor as battery and as voltage stabilizer.

I have two questions.

1. After my Phoenix Inverter turns off when capacitor runs below certain voltage it will wait for at least 30 seconds until power up again (if I meanwhile pedal and charge my capacitor above a certain voltage it will then start again after 30s) . Can I somehow bypass this 30s security timer? Or just put it really low like 1s? I want the Inverter to as quickly as possible start passing current through again after a low battery voltage shut off.

2. Now the inverter will always give an output of 230V AC if it has sufficient voltage from the battery and it will either power my device on the other side fully or not power it at all. Is it possible to dumb the inverter down to let all the current pass through always? I'm thinking if it is possible to remove any component inside to get rid of this security in the device? I understand this could damage my components on the other side because the voltage would fluctuate a lot but the purpose is for the output voltage to vary somewhat instead of being constant 230V. This would be in a combination with a relay connected to the capacitor to have a more sensible fluctuation, for the ability to power a device "partially".

Thanks,
/Edvin

Phoenix Inverter
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2 Answers
markus avatar image
markus answered ·

This doesn't sound, as it would be possible.

I would consider to use an AC bike alternator, and transforming the voltage with a transformer to 230V.

Where do you want to supply power to, with this?

Regards,

Markus

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edvinerikssonjohanssonctk avatar image edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·
Thanks for your reply Markus,


I will power lamps and devices like phone charger or small kitchen ware in educational purpose.

My bike alternator provides 3 phase AC but I am using a rectifier to get DC, I need DC to dump excess power with a Solar Charge Controller. I also measure the current here to know generated and consumed power.

So I want to be able to power the devices on a range up to 230V, and still able to measure the generated and consumed power. With the security of the Solar Charge Controller to dump excess power.

Thanks,
/Edvin

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markus avatar image markus ♦♦ edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·

This is not so easy to archive. As those inverters always tend to stabilize.

I could think of a relay, that switches the inverter on and off depending on produced power by the cyclist. And until the AC inverter is switched "on" have some DC consumption shown over light bulbs or similar...

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edvinerikssonjohanssonctk avatar image edvinerikssonjohanssonctk markus ♦♦ commented ·

I am not sure if the inverter can be flipped on/off quickly with a relay or if it will stay off again for 30s.

I have thought of some relay that switches the loads on or off when cyclist i producing enough power, i.e. high enough voltage on capacitor. This would hopefully let the inverter stay on all the time, and if you are not producing enough power the relay will turn off again quickly. But I am not sure about the pedal resistance here for the cyclist if it will jump up and down too much.

What did you mean by "have some DC consumption shown over light bulbs or similar"?

Thanks
/Edvin

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markus avatar image markus ♦♦ edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·

I meant, having some board with DC light bulbs or similar, when the cyclist begins to ride, only light bulbs show the power, and when 12V are reached, the inverter engages and power 230V devices. As long as the cyclist begins to struggle and power drops below 12V, then the relay switches off the inverter instead of low voltage cutoff. ...just thoughts.

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edvinerikssonjohanssonctk avatar image edvinerikssonjohanssonctk markus ♦♦ commented ·

Yes thanks, that might be an option.

I could maybe just have DC light bulbs.

In the case of trying other devices that requires high voltage AC, I can go with devices with some moment of inertia, let say a mixer, that would possibly work even if the relay would switch on/off a lot. Compared to a lamp that would blink, maybe the result would be it could run on lower speed if the relay switches on/off quick enough.

Thanks,
/Edvin

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markus avatar image markus ♦♦ edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·

I was thinking of a similar solution, as my girlfriend likes to ride on the hometrainer. She could charge the batteries and train herself at the same time ;o)

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wkirby avatar image
wkirby answered ·

I'm intrigued with what you are doing, seems like an interesting project.
You have an understanding of why those measures are in place, but they are not simple hardware hacks to make it do what you want. Most of those features are written in the firmware of the microcontroller's CPU.

Like Markus said, you are probably better off with just a simple step up transformer from your bike generator.

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edvinerikssonjohanssonctk avatar image edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·

Thanks for your reply,

As previous comment I am bound somewhat to the components I already have and the needed functions.

I assume it would be hard to access this firmware somehow, but is it possible?

Thanks,
/Edvin

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wkirby avatar image wkirby ♦♦ edvinerikssonjohanssonctk commented ·

No, it would not be possible to gain access to the firmware. Victron, like anyone else, would keep their Intellectual Property safe I'm sure. I would like to think that "Code Protect ON" is the fuse setting in the microcontroller.

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