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energy avatar image
energy asked

Error 17 - Look like Harmonics problem

I have a problem with an installation that manifests as Error 17 in a house when the lift goes from ground to 2nd floor. It is a 6 x Multi-2 system, 3-Ph, 2 inverters per phase.

Currently Comms cables are:

  • At least 10cm from any electrical cables. Where it crosses (1 incidence), it crosses at 90 deg.
  • Comms cables are CAT6A, as short as possible.
  • Works with load from zero and varying between 2 and 4 kW (normal house load).
  • As soon as lift starts (3Ph lift) the inverters switch off with error 17, followed by the normal recovery.

All S/W at latest version 2623-510 on inverters and Cerbo at v3.32.

Works correct with 3 x Multi-2’s but problem with 6 x Multi-2’s.

SO, I suspect the VSD of the lift is causing harmonic load problems. It draws 10A per phase (400/230v).

I have an oscilloscope that can do FFT, so I want to measure harmonics at some stage. (Need to find correct probes, which I have not used in years.)

Please comment if you believe I am on the right track.

error
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Alexandra avatar image Alexandra ♦ commented ·

Maybe some more specifics like what size mp2s you have? What size battery bank(in nominal amps not kwh)? What size is the lift vsd and elevator kit.

The problem sounds like only a problem in parrallel so it could also be the parrallel setup and current share there.

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Duivert NL avatar image
Duivert NL answered ·

have you taken a look at this? :

https://www.victronenergy.com/live/ve.bus:ve.bus_error_codes

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energy avatar image
energy answered ·

Hello Duivert. That you for the feedback.

I am miles and miles beyond the level of investigation that you are suggesting. That document was my thought in the 1st 2 minutes. We are referring to a much more complicated problem here. I am dusting off my Fourier Transform knowledge, which is unfortunately way above the average level of this group. I don't want to be dismissive, but this is a complex problem, that require expert knowledge. I don't want trivial suggestions to cloud this topic.

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nickdb avatar image nickdb ♦♦ commented ·

Then you need to follow the official support procedure.

As an internet community you're going to get lots of comment, since error 17 is typically a comms issue, sometimes a fault, as you'd be aware.

What you're asking is way above the site paygrade.

Maybe you get lucky and staff pick it up, but generally, those that could give an expert answer like this are unlikely to be lurking here.

It can pay to go back to basics and check all the inverters, that everything is evenly distributed.

Since no one knows the history or what has/hasn't been done you can expect to get advice that you have already tried.

The internet is not suited for dealing with complex problems, and too many involve detail that has not been shared nor can be accessed remotely.

Good luck.


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Duivert NL avatar image Duivert NL nickdb ♦♦ commented ·

Since no one knows the history or what has/hasn't been done you can expect to get advice that you have already tried.


yup, you have to start somewhere :)

parallel systems are complex so they can also make complex problems


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energy avatar image
energy answered ·

Victron's support procedure, whatever that is, and in fact all of their support, is a complete waste of time. At this stage I would love to know what the maximum THD on the load current is, before the inverters give up.

BUT, I won't even ask, sure Victron does not even know.

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Duivert NL avatar image Duivert NL commented ·
I disagree, they are very supportive, but its a real technical isseu/question, maybe @mvader (Victron Energy) can help you with this or connect you with the right technician
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Alexandra avatar image Alexandra ♦ Duivert NL commented ·

Weird about the vsd harmonics. I know of plenty systems whose only job is pumps with vsds and the don't have the issue.

We can make assumptions like the system is correctly sized here including battery cables and banks. Do you have all the needed filters installed on the vsd?

Have you contacted your dealer to escalate the issue through the official channels as suggested in the manual.


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energy avatar image
energy answered ·

How do I draw @mvader (Victron Energy) attention to this.

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