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ebringas avatar image
ebringas asked

Victron EV charger dynamic load balancing doesn’t work without DIY NodeRED

Hi all,


Posting this as a warning for all people looking into getting an EV charger,


If you are not confortable with setting up a server / raspberry/ etc. having to purchase it expending extra or setting the node red in a cerbo (in case you have it) and want a charger that does dynamic load balancing don’t get the Victron EV charger in any of the versions, as the Victron way of handling it is flawed, it will reduce the charge power if you get close to the limit for the installation (like for example what happens when other appliances in your home turn on) and never restore it back, getting to the point of even modifying the scheduled charge plan with this new lower setting (6 amps for example).


This way of working cripples the charge unless you’re continuously modifying it by hand each day, but you will inevitably find your ev having charge very little during nights when this happens and you didn’t notice.


Victron staff on this forum are aware of this (you can see the post linked) but replied that is the way they wanted the charger to work


Meanwhile any other smart charger in the same price range won’t have this bug or “flawed feature”, so you need to decide based on your expectations and personal needs, do you want a charger that does a lot of tricks (like many other in the market) but fails at the very basic stuff? Are you comfortable with making some DIY on a final consumer product to have this basic functionality?


you can take a look at this post for Victron staff reply from @Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff)


https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/263471/evcs-throttling-charge-power-on-schedule.html?childToView=272018#comment-272018


Free advise, if you’re looking into Victron charger for fit connectivity, integration, and remote control capabilities, you could go with any smart charger with a developed app and network connection, if you need to be able to control it automatically then any with modbus communication support.

ev charging station
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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·
We've discussed this, your specific case doesn't apply to all the customers.

You don't need a server or a Raspberry Pi, just enable large image on your Cerbo and you have Node-red running inside.

So if you want to solve the issue, you can easily do that.
But developing something, just for one customer, is not what a company does.

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ebringas avatar image ebringas Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·

As already stated several times, “my case” as you call it, it is the case of any other user that wants or needs a working dynamic load balancing system to fully optimize their system, take full advantage of night lower tariff or have other consumers on their systems that might go active while the charging sesion is active, thus needing the charger to dynamically adjust the charge power while the spike happens and the, and this is the most important, and what Lucian , seems to simply ignore or just don’t understand, the charger needs to adjust back to whatever charge power it has or was programmed to before, but yes Lucian, if you feel better justifying it as this is something that no one wants then go ahead!


Is this the first smart charger you’ve dealed with? It is hard to understand that you say it is OK they way it is or that it is a use case specific to me, then why is the rest of the worlds smart chargers offering this capability? Seems like a weird coincidence and waste of resources just to adapt to a single use case don’t you think?


To anyone out there looking for an EV charger and needing dynamic load balancing look elsewhere this Victron EV charge station even though it advertises as being capable of, it is not, you will either have to program it yourself (like really coding it) or make peace with having to manually having to adjust the charge power each time, if you charge during the night as I do, then you will find yourself with your carge having charge just 3-4% because the microwave or the heater turned on 10 minutes during the charge session.


Just in case anyone wonders if it is a power thing about my house, it is not, because my previous charger handled it without issues before going to Victron, my neighbor have even less power than me and a older charger without even internet connectivity but a normal load balancing and works like a charm.


So Lucian don’t worry, if it is like you said “a single use case” then this information won’t be read or apply to anyone else out there, hopefully it will help other to avoid wasting money on something that doesn’t deliver what they need, I wish I could have found out about this before purchasing it.

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chinook avatar image
chinook answered ·

@ebringas I bought the Victron EVCS and i'm very happy with my decision.

I'm not sure if i understand your needed solution correct, but until now the Victron System works fine for me. I've a System with a MPPT450/200, 3x MP2 3000/48, 15kWh Battery and a Fronius 8kW Inverter all together 14kW Peak Solar Power and mainly use it for solar consumption in auto mode.

I setup my EVCS to work with 1 and 3 Phase switching Beta Functionality, with some trouble today after the update to the Firmware 1.28, but i'm quite happy with my WB (I'm sure, if explain my trouble with the BETA functionallity in a thread i will get response from a Victron Developer!). For an Invest below 700€ for all, having a WB able to charge between 1.xxkW and 11.xxkW, it's the best price in the market. My next best alternative was the OpenWB but costs above 1200€...

I also have ideas for additional functionallity, but that is possibly a very personal solution...

I think to be realy happy with the EVCS you will need a Victron System. I don't need to setup a raspberry Pi or a Server or something else, plug in my WB, go through the setup instructions (might not be easy for someone without technical traning) and it's running and is fully integrated to my Victron System.

What you get is a company with developers corresponding with customers, a strong community and a flexible system.

I would recommend you, buy another WB, spend double the price and try to get in contact to a system developer of the company to setup your solution.

@Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) I read some of the threads you respond to and I appreciate to get a detailed technical answer.

Kind regards

Korbinian

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ebringas avatar image ebringas commented ·

Hi Chinook,


I have a Victron eco system, they was what made me decide to go for the Victron EV charger.


This is not about the possibility it offers, that are plenty, but the lack of a basic one! Dynamic load balancing, you don’t need to go 1.200€ to get that, my previous one 545€ retail price handled it but offered no connectivity (what made me change), my neighbor 650€ V2C one handled it but as I had the Victron system I decided to go with this one instead.


The Node red set up is the only option and what mentioned by Lucian as Victron thinks that dynamic load balancing is a rare use case and even when a customer paid the full price for a final consumer product he still needs to do some DIY to get it to do basic things and it is what I’m complaining about.


I have 9kw available power during the night (lower tariff) so the charger goes full power, but then the heat pump starts some time around the night for 10min and the charge power is reduced, as expected, all fine till now, but once the heat pump or whatever other load drops off the charge power is never restored so I’m left with 2-3kw charge power for the rest of the night.


Not only that but, I’m using the scheduler, and the scheduler set charge power is also reduced for the next days.


According to Lucian it is OK and it is the expected behavior, and if I want anything different I can set up node red and do it myself….


Really, if i wanted to do DIY stuff I would have built a DIY charger.


So only a word of caution to other that like me the amazing capabilities of the charger are appreciated extras and bonuses but the basic stuff needs to be granted, otherwise it doesnt make sense.


You’re happy with your interaction with Victron staff, as it should be! But not my case, you can go in the original post I linked above and see,Lucian first said no, then offered to provide a solution, instead of that went to test another unrelated thing (charge power to zero) that was warned that wouldn’t work for all cars, then came back saying that zero charge power didn’t work for all cars (what he was told before even trying), then finally replied that dynamic load balancing was oK the way it was and that I can set up node red if I want to….


Sorry but not the best approach for customer support at least in my experience.

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wilm avatar image
wilm answered ·

If you are unable to tailor your EV-charger to your special needs with Node-Red, why bother other people? There is no company I do know, which provides you Node-Red out of the box to modify the behaviour of their systems.

If I had to select a EV-Charger, I would go for Victron. No other one would provide ma the ability to tailor it in Node-Red.

Just my 2 cents,
Wilm

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ebringas avatar image ebringas commented ·
Hi wilm,


How I’m I bothering you exactly? Don’t want to come off rude or anything but, you can just keep scrolling, no issue at all.


The post is for any that like me need the basic functionality of a charger granted, the extra capabilities are always welcomed, and the possibilities this charger offers are vast, but facts are facts, it can’t do basic dynamic load balancing, and that is a critical thing for me for example.


It is great that you’re able and want to tailor things to your needs by using node red, really good for you, but dynamic load balancing is no special tailoring, it isn’t a specific use case it is just plain basic ev wall box functionality and this charger can’t handled it correctly, if you go anywhere close to the overload limit then the charge power is not lowered until other loads drop off like regular balancing works rather is crippled down for good, even for the programmed scheduling for the next charge session.


I didn’t get a final consumer product to have to do DIY acrobatics to have basic functionality, I would be ok if for some additional thing that I needed I had to go through those hoops but not for standard behavior.


You can and want to program your own stuff? Good for you, t


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