question

alexspecht avatar image
alexspecht asked

wired network using ve.direct

Hello,

Im new to this forum and am considering seting up a victron system for my travel trailer.

Ideally I would like to buy the BVM-702 and a BLUE solar MPPT 100/15 to repace my sunforce (coleman) PWM.

My question is, can I use a ve.direct cable to connect the two devices BM<-->MPPT. And if so, How can I monitor that network?

Since its a really basic system PV->PWM->GEL I cant really justify $$ for a GX device.

Could I use VE.direct to RS-232 -> LAN converters and just plug everrything into a basic network switch??

I looked at the smart solar with the BT connections (really slick) but I always prefer a wired connection anyway

thanks in advance


VE.Direct
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Kevin Windrem avatar image
Kevin Windrem answered ·

VE.Direct can not be used between these two units. You'd need a GX device to host both devices. Then the GX device would show status of both on the same screen. DVCC in the GX device would then send the BMV's voltage and temperature to the Blue Solar.

A GX device is pretty expensive addition to such a basic system. It's mainly used in a system with a MultiPlus or Quattro inverter/charger, battery monitor, MPPT and other components.

What you might consider is a SmartShunt in place of the BMV-702 and a Smart Solar MPPT. Both of these have bluetooth and can be setup to network for sharing voltage and temperature. An app on your phone, tablet or computer can then monitor/control both devices. The Victron MPPT line has no local display. The BMV series does have a local display but it will not show status of the MPPT even if they are bluetooth networked.

Hope that helps.

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alexspecht avatar image alexspecht commented ·

Thanks for that, now I understand that VE.direct can not be used the same way as the bluetooth network.

That being said, say I have both units synced together with BT:

- Would I be able to use the monitor app on my PC with a USB - VE.Direct adapter?

- Would I see both devices or just the one I was directly plugged into?

- Would it matter which device I was plugged into via USB?

- Finally is there any way to do this with wires instead of BT?


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Kevin Windrem avatar image Kevin Windrem alexspecht commented ·

VE.Dicrect supports only one device at a time.

You could use TWO VE.Dicrect to USB adapters and see both in VictronConnect on our computer. At this point you would not need Bluetooth at all.

The benefit of Bluetooth is you don't need the wires and you can use whatever computer/tablet/phone you have that supports bluetooth.

Victron networking requires Bluetooth on each device in the network. So your Blue Solar and BMV-702 would not network. The devices talk to each other over Bluetooth and not through a computer/tablet/phone.

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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

The different controller specifications are at https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Datasheet-BlueSolar-and-SmartSolar-charge-controller-overview-EN.pdf

The bluesolar 200/15 is listed as having a VE.direct Comms port.

From memory the BMV 702 has Bluetooth, but best check.

So your route is VE.direct to the BMV, monitoring via Bluetooth between your phone and the Victron connect app as well as what's on the BMV screen.


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alexspecht avatar image alexspecht commented ·

the 702 doesnt have BT the 712 does, but I also read somewhere on this forum that communication is done with either BT (ve. smart) --OR-- VE.direct (wired), not both

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Justin Cook avatar image
Justin Cook answered ·

What is your goal in networking the battery monitor with the MPPT?

Both the battery monitor and the solar controller function perfectly well as standalone units; while you can't connect them directly with VE.Direct cables, what the solution would be will depend on what you're trying to accomplish.

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alexspecht avatar image alexspecht commented ·

From reading the MPPT manual, I was under the impression that the solar controller uses the SOC and current (shunt) and temperature data from the battery monitor to adjust the charge cycle

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Justin Cook avatar image Justin Cook ♦♦ alexspecht commented ·

Where do you see that in the manual? I haven't worked with BlueSolar models in years, but I can't find any indication of any circumstance under which that information would be shared from a battery monitor to an MPPT - only battery voltage and temperature when using one of the networked options.

In any case, though, one cannot connect a battery monitor directly to a solar controller with VE.Direct, so some rethinking of the system design will likely be necessary no matter what.

ve.png

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alexspecht avatar image alexspecht Justin Cook ♦♦ commented ·

Sorry, It was in the Battery Monitor Manual:


6.3. Connecting to VE.Smart networking
VE.Smart networking is a wireless network that allows a number of Victron products to exchange information via Bluetooth. The
battery monitor can share the following information with the network:
• Battery voltage.
• Battery current.
• Battery temperature. Note that an optional temperature sensor is needed see chapter Auxiliary connection for temperature
monitoring.
A usage example is a system with VE.Smart networking that contains a battery monitor with a temperature sensor and a solar
charger. The solar charger receives the battery voltage and temperature information from the battery monitor and uses this
information to optimise its charge parameters. This will improve charging efficiency and will prolong battery life.

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pwfarnell avatar image pwfarnell alexspecht commented ·
But all devices on VE Smart Network need to be smart, i.e. BT devices which the BMV 702 and BlueSolar are not.
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Kevin Windrem avatar image Kevin Windrem pwfarnell commented ·
VE.Direct is a "host to device" connection. MPPT and BMV are both devices and therefore can't communicate with each other that way.


VEdirect uses a simple serial protocol where the host sets a value or requests status. The device on the other end replies to that request. You are asking for the BMV to make requests of the MPPT or visa-versa. In essence, you are asking for one of the devices to become the host. It can not. Besides the significant software impact, the VE.Direct cable connects the transmitter of the host to the receive of the device. If you connect a VE.Direct cable between two devices, then the transmitter connects to the transmitter. No data will change hands.

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alexspecht avatar image alexspecht pwfarnell commented ·
so could i connect the smart mppt with the smart BMV712 with a ve.direct cable and turn off bluetooth?
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pwfarnell avatar image pwfarnell alexspecht commented ·
No, for a SmartShunt and SmartSolar you would connect via Smart Network, i.e. Bluetooth. For VE Direct you need to go through a GX device or a Raspberry pi running Venus OS.
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Justin Cook avatar image Justin Cook ♦♦ alexspecht commented ·

No. You cannot connect the MPPT to the battery monitor with a VE.Direct cable. VE.Smart Networking is a wireless network, NOT a wired one.

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kevgermany avatar image kevgermany ♦♦ alexspecht commented ·
Note that VE.direct and smart networking are not compatible.

Don't turn off Bluetooth. You'll lose the ability to connect from your phone.


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elvis avatar image
elvis answered ·

You can buy a Raspberry pi in place of a Victron GX device.

Many people run them very successfully with no issues.

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alexspecht avatar image
alexspecht answered ·

Thanks for all the replies.

Today I went over to Bay Marine Supply in San Diego and picked up the Smart Solar 100/30 and BMV-712 with temp sensor.

Just hooked up the BMV to my existing system and it works great.

Found an unexpected loophole, I forgot I can just use screen mirroring on my PC with scrcpy, so I am able to use the app with BT on my PC ...serendipity.

Looks great... thrilled with data!

Cheers!


PS. Its also great that Victron posts the android APK so installing the app to android using my PC was way easier and less annoying than using google play.


vicrtonconnect-screenshot.png


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Related Resources

VE.Direct protocol FAQ