question

liquant avatar image
liquant asked

victron+Pylontech offgrid versus Victron+BYD offgrid

Hello Off-Grid Fans,

we currently design a 3phase off-grid island: Dual-string PV (> 7 KW) terminating in 1 MPPT RS450/100, Cerbo+Touch, 3x Multiplus-II 48/5000/70-50 feeding a CE16 EV charge outlet (< 11kW). Storagewise, a 12+ kWh LiFePo4 either from Pylontech or BYD are currently planned for the initial test config.

Now, there’s a lot of really outstanding video material re: Victron&BYD, mostly from Guy Stewart and a few others. Unfortunately, we haven’t come across similar training material on Victron&Pylontech - but it may have escaped our blurred attention. Since - on the other hand - Pylontech batteries are more readily available, we’d greatly appreciate experiences shared re: 6xUS2000 or 4xUS3000 or BYD Premium LVS12 or other… as energy store in this kind of use. We understand that Victron works with all of the above but any non-budgetary aspect/ reason why people chose this of that configuration would be helpful.

specifically for DE: Falls jemand reale Erfahrungen mit ähnlichen, NICHT-netzgekoppelten Lade-Infrastrukturen in DE hat, sind wir für jeden Tipp dankbar.

Thankyou for your patient reading up to here!


PylontechoffgridBYD
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3 Answers
wkirby avatar image
wkirby answered ·

I opted for the Pylontech solution due to price and availability. Also the interface is direct no need for a BYD box (or whatever they call it). You only need a Pylontech LV hub when you want more than 16 modules of USX000C.
I started with three US3000C. They were very easy to install and configure, just following the instructions here:
https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom

Later on I decided to add another US3000C module. Again, it was very easy to do, I just had to make the space in my rack and connect the cables. The system recognised the change right away and it just works very well.

pxl-20211231-174011023.jpg


My cabling is a little bit neater that you would get with the standard cables. I fabricated the feedthrough panel at the top and made a custom length positive cable.


pxl-20211231-174011023.jpg (2.8 MiB)
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liquant avatar image liquant commented ·

Hi wkirby,

since I erroneously wrote my first comment as an answer, once again:

really wish to thank you: the central BMU of BYD vs the apparently distributed approach of Pylontech was one of our headaches; your experience re: "just go by the book" with the configuration is one of those hints that we were looking for. Very encouraging!

Also, your mobile rack with customized wiring looks really good, you should sell the feedthrough panel!

kind regards

@liquant (h schaefer)

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klandos avatar image klandos commented ·

@WKirby

are you sure that this:

You only need a Pylontech LV hub when you want more than 8 modules.

is still true on the us3000c ?

I thought it is only when non "C" types are used?

Or is it true only when using victron?

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Rob Duthie avatar image Rob Duthie klandos commented ·


Make sure the batteries have the latest firmware and also the LV hub as well the latest firmware. As i have found out with this installation.

I have used 12 modules of the UPS3000 in a system of late enclosed photos of a current install with my own enclosure with LVH hub installed at the very top

Regards
Rob D

NZ

20211216-152419.jpg

20211216-152337.jpg

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klandos avatar image klandos Rob Duthie commented ·

Please keep in mind I asked after the USx000C version.

As stated in the manual, up to 16 should be possible without LV Hub

See:

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/2062563/Pylontech-Us3000c.html?page=25#manual

And for the LV Hub configuration it is stated that each group can consist of 16 pcs.

See:

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/2062563/Pylontech-Us3000c.html?page=28#manual


Is it possible to use up to 16 Pylontech Version C without LV Hub?

Or is there any limit for 8 pieces through victron?

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Nico Bayer avatar image Nico Bayer klandos commented ·
I run 12x US3000C without a LV Hub. The C series can be connected up to 16 modules without a LV Hub
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klandos avatar image klandos Nico Bayer commented ·
Thanks for clarifying!
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wkirby avatar image wkirby ♦♦ klandos commented ·
Yes, sorry, my mistake. It is 16x USX000C in a group without LV-HUB.


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Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) avatar image
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) answered ·

Hi @liquant

I consider BYD and Pylontech equals regarding Victron compatibility and support.

I have used both myself personally over long periods of time and would readily recommend either one in a Victron system.

The decision then should be made on other characteristics.

The first and most important to me (as an installer) is the local distribution and support network available to you personally, and the existing experience of your team. Those are the biggest deciding factors in my opinion.

For my own interest, what kind of content would you like to see regarding Pylontech that would give you more confidence?

Also, regardless of your choice, if the customer is fully off grid and there is no possibility of an auxiliary supply, I STRONGLY recommend that you take the time before installation to balance the individual battery modules from the grid before installation - this is the #1 biggest issue I see.

You can connect them to a Cerbo GX, and check on VRM to make sure the cell max and cell min voltages are within spec when 100% charged. I know its a pain, but it can save so much grief and is a lot harder to resolve once off grid.

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liquant avatar image liquant commented ·
Hi Guy,

thankyou for your very fast reply and your valuable hint re: initial balancing the modules from the grid. We'll follow your suggested procedure. Always good to know the traps in advance.

Now, re your question what kind of content re Pylontech:

As newcomers to the Victron world we watched your trainings on Victron-with-BYD carefully, some of them several times. In particular, the training videos #5 (Multiplus-II wiring to BYD) and #9.2 (Advanced training 3Phase and Parallel) as well as the "Intro to BYD LVL LVS..." on Vimeo. They all show the real life products, the wiring, configuration...and pitfalls. Very to the point and efficient!

So, in a nutshell we'd like to see: training video(s) on building a 3 Phase system with Multiplus-II and current Pylontech batteries, let's call it #9.2-PT-2022. The wiring part could start where the Pylontechs come into play (e.g. repeating or just referencing the Multiplus-II wiring in #9.2). Followed by diving into the configuration parameters and commissioning of this setup. Possible add-ons: limitations, performance enhancements, best practise.

Yes, we're spoiled ;-)

Thankyou and your team again for sharing your real world insight into the exciting world of consumer owned energy production,

@liquant (h schaefer)

Note: I wrote this as a comment to figure the difference to an answer. Hope both work.





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liquant avatar image
liquant answered ·

Hi wkirby,

really wish to thank you: the central BMU of BYD vs the apparently distributed approach of Pylontech was one of our headaches; your experience re: "just go by the book" with the configuration is what we were looking for. Very encouraging!

Also, your mobile rack with customized wiring looks really good, you should sell the feedthrough panel!

kind regards

@liquant

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