article

Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) posted Mar 20, '24

Dynamic ESS on VRM

It’s been a long time coming, from now on Dynamic ESS is live on VRM!

Edit: Discussion for DESS has moved here - https://victron.discourse.group/c/products/dess/21

2024-05-07: Make sure to check https://community.victronenergy.com/articles/283506/dynamic-ess-green-mode.html too.

What is Dynamic ESS?

Dynamic ESS is an algorithm that aims to minimize the costs made on the grid and battery. It does this by taking several factors into account. First of all the energy price that, in case of a dynamic energy contract, changes every hour. Then it also looks at the solar and consumption forecast. Together with the grid limitations and battery costs and specifications it creates a schedule for the system that determines when to (dis)charge the battery.

Note that the system is not limited to dynamic contracts; it also works for systems that have a fixed pricing scheme.

What do I need to use Dynamic ESS?

Dynamic ESS is only eligible for the installations which fits the following criteria:

Be an ESS;
Not use Generator connection outside of power outages;
Has 2-way communication enabled
Run Venus OS version 3.30 (or newer)

For best results:

Have a variable or dynamic energy contract.
Use a supported energy meter (especially if your system setup has heavy loads (EV charger, heat pumps) in front of the Victron system). See here for more information on this.

How can I configure it?

If your site has an ESS, the menu option to configure Dynamic ESS for your site will show. There is a configuration menu that you will need to fill out, before you can actually use it. While we tried to make it as easy as possible, you are likely to do some research in order to fill out all the questions. For instance, you will need to know your battery capacity and the amount of kilowatts it is capable of (dis)charging in an hour. But you will also need to know the formulas that build up the actual price that you pay for buying energy from and selling to the grid. These formulas are not the most straightforward thing to find as the info needed for it is usually somewhere in your energy providers contract.

We provide some example formulas in the dropdown, but that is no guarantee that it matches your actual contract. You need to check that yourself. The manual also gives some examples on how to take the step from your contract to the right formula.

Known limitations

After this go-live, we will continuously improve Dynamic ESS.

Some of the things on our todo list:

Maximizing battery charge by the end of the day to cover consumption until sunrise
Periodically fully charge the battery to improve battery life
Adding support for varying service fees based on the time of day
Allowing users to enter a fixed schedule for grid-battery restrictions
Supporting fixed prices that change on the half-hour instead of the whole hour
Introducing (smart) support for high-consumption loads such as EV charging and heat pumps

More information

If you need more information, check out the manual. There has already been a lot of discussions on the beta implementation in the comments of five previous articles.

As always, we appreciate your feedback. Feel free to let us know how to improve, and thank you for being part of the development journey. To streamline communication, older posts are closed for comments, and any new feedback can be provided in this post.

When reporting a possible issue, please also mention your VRM id.

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alex-itcus commented · Mar 25 at 04:00 PM

Hi, DESS is very frustrating. :))
7 days of trying it made me stop using it.
It has 2 rules it implements all the time that I consider counterproductive:
1. it delays the charging from solar until it is too late and it keeps charging from grid. Most of the time this comes over other surprise consumption - so it never gets the target SOC - hour by hour
2. the target SOC is never achieved in the hour. Even is most of the time less than ”I would do” it never gets ti it even there is plenty solar and no consumption to delay the charge. It does not start charging or it is charging at slow rates (1-4Ah)

This is today and before NOW I started charging it in ESS mode as it was clear it will never get to 100% even in the morning this was the ever to be miss target.

So, it charged many times with expensive grid power with a behaviour like ”UPS, I forgot to charge”.
My MP2 - 5000/48/70 - 5KWh bat - 4.3KW solar on AC-out1 with two 112 (grid and solar)

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ alex-itcus commented · Mar 26 at 07:43 AM

These are all valid points. On the Node-RED implementation we are experimenting with charging earlier and more in the battery while the sun is still out. I expect that to be moved to the VRM implementation within the next 2 weeks.

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alex-itcus Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 27 at 08:02 AM

Thank you for the hard work!

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kositch Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 26 at 08:36 AM

Perfect looking forward to test it, now I need to turn DESS off because of that. Is there some way to be informed when this change happens? Will it require Cerbo OS update?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ kositch commented · Mar 26 at 12:05 PM

It is likely only an update on the scheduling side, which does not require an update on the Cerbo. I'll make a new community post when that happens.

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kositch alex-itcus commented · Mar 26 at 06:03 AM

I totally agree, there should be option to prioritize battery charging to desired SoC or just "full" before selling the PV Power to the grid....

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grua kositch commented · Mar 26 at 06:34 AM

At the very least, the priority in the planning of the DESS should be fundamentally changed so that the battery is always charged first and PV surplus is always sold afterwards.

This is currently planned the other way around. DESS often sells first and then only charges the battery towards the end of PV production. This can result in the need to recharge from the grid towards the evening if PV production in the afternoon is lower than forecast.

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alex-itcus alex-itcus commented · Mar 26 at 09:41 AM

Discovered that turning off DESS when the sun shines makes the whole system work great!
So DESS worked for one hour (9to10) as it should: supporting consumption and charging from solar. Then it idled the battery at 19% and start exporting to grid at 10:01. Between 10 and 11 it was supposed to charge 0.33KWh from solar even that the solar produced only in the first 30 minutes more than 1.6KWh. The battery was idle for the first 30 minutes, moment when I stopped DESS.

Funny side appart, does anyone now on how to automate this until DESS is unbroken? Maybe DESS is made to work only without solar at this point?

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alex-itcus alex-itcus commented · Mar 26 at 09:58 AM

The plan looks totally wrong. We have 7.1 kWh forecasted but only 0.6 for battery charge

1. solar forecast is most of the time 50% less than reality

2. battery is not charged even with the small amount scheduled as it is kept idle

3. the solar is wasted on grid even I have zero euro for selling (!) and zero on battery cost.

As you can see in the plan, the battery is supposed to be charged with 2.5kWh from grid wasting all the surplus solar that do not fit to the plan.

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grua alex-itcus commented · Mar 26 at 10:22 AM

As Dirk-Jan mentioed here, this should be better in some weeks:

https://community.victronenergy.com/comments/272031/view.html

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john245 alex-itcus commented · May 01 at 12:26 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

Energy prices including taxes are negative in the Netherlands between 13:00 and 14:00. However costs are displayed in the chart.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ john245 commented · May 01 at 12:42 PM

That looks like a graphing bug. Thanks for reporting. We are looking into that.

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ronaldt commented · Apr 04 at 05:37 PM

I did not receive an update today regarding the day ahead prices. Am I the only one?

It is 19:37 so the should have been there. Is there a way to actively pull them?

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zonnigbreda ronaldt commented · Apr 04 at 06:47 PM

Here the same... I assume something went wrong in the dataload today. But it begs the question, is there some auotmated refresh happening in this case so the situation corrects itself?

As tomorrow there are negative prices for me, it would be bad timing if I miss ' the free meal' .
Anyway, I saw it by accident thatit is not available, but I hope this is a ' set and forget' sort of thing, not something I need to monitor daily.

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Jeroen Peters ronaldt commented · Apr 04 at 05:43 PM

Same situation here. Auction outcome on EPEX website is published 12.45h. Victron should be able to push them at 13h or 14h latest. Especially when high prices next morning sometimes provide the opportunity to charge a bit more still.

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sni ronaldt commented · Apr 05 at 08:56 AM

Same here on stable and Beta OS installed. I Hope for 1 pm.

Id c0619ab0f3ad

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Enya Salida commented · Apr 09 at 09:28 AM

I'm sorry having to confirm some of the often mentioned issues and I turn off DESS for now. The biggest problem for me could be solved by a simple additional rule:

never ever feed any power into grid if the battery still can take it!

This must be obeyed if “Can you sell energy back to the grid? No” is selected and also if you can sell, at least in Germany feed in rarely is a better deal than storage and self consumption.

Also annoying: if I switch on high loads like washing machine or heat pump for hot water intentionally in times with very low prices I don’t want them to be supplied from battery – which will be recharged afterwards at higher prices – at least if not very much solar is expected.

I’m sure the calculation of the optimal SOC for every hour with unpredictable conditions is not easy to do and I thank Victron Energy and Dirk-Jan Faber very much for this development!

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Gonzalo chain Enya Salida commented · May 01 at 06:13 AM

This could be solve if they implemented some fixed configurable rules to work in conjunction with dynamic ESS. I would also like to have this capability without having to turn off the complete dESS

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mheinze5722 commented · Apr 03 at 06:26 AM

Right now it seems the algorithm strictly optimizes to reduce cost, as exemplified here:

Right now, it really optmizes a single day for reducing cost and optimizing revenue: and of course that means, exhaust the battery to the minimum of 15% SOC at the end of the day. But that is not what I want. It misses the rest of the night (which it will probably only add 'in scope' once rates are out at around 2 pm) - but then it is too late to fully charge the battery. Also, I want the battery usually rather full instead of just charging the minimum to be better prepared for grid outages or occasionally higher consumption over night.

As such, I (as a house owner; boat, RV, commercial or industry could be different) would like to see my LFP battery to rather charge to 100% every day (NMC could be 80% charge goal in warm&sunny months), and charge slowly to extent battery life and reduce midday-feed-in-peak.

As such, the goal should be extended to:

Dynamic ESS is an algorithm that aims to minimise the costs made on the grid and battery, based on following expectations:

- aims to charge the battery every day to "Default Charging Limit" [LFP=100%, NMC warm&sunny=80%]

- Aims to charge the battery until after midday-peak to slow/steady battery charging for battery longevity, reduce midday-feed-in peak and reduce AC->DC conversion losses.

- Aims to hold the battery SOC level rather higher than lower, for situations of grid outages and unexpected (higher) consumptions.

Thanks for reading, Michael

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kositch mheinze5722 commented · Apr 04 at 12:00 PM

Yes same for me, there should be some option to request charging battery to full each day if PV is surplus, because I know a lot of installations where customer requested turning on AC2 out based on SoC criteria to heat the boiler from PV energy which would be sent to grid and if SoC will not reach above that SoC it will never turn boiler on and instead of it it will sell the energy, which I dont want to disable because when boiler is heated up, I want to sell it. Not sure how to handle this, something like "sell energy but only when SoC of battery reaches 100%" or something like that for those who use surplus PV energy to store to the boiler....

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gdhondt commented · Apr 03 at 08:33 PM

Dear Victron team.

Frank energie/Bliq and zonneplan are offering ESS system from different brands which are compatible with trading on the “onbalans markt” this would also be a huge benefit if Victron can provide this function in cooperation with an energy supplier.

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john245 gdhondt commented · Apr 04 at 08:27 PM

I know Tibber is investigating if they can add Victron.

People are earning > Euro 200,- last month on this market. Very interesting and would be a good selling point for Victron.

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meyo084 commented · Mar 20 at 05:45 PM

Hi, quick finding.. dyness ignores max charge and discharge at the moment.. anyone got the same?

Site c0619ab38e24

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Jeroen Peters meyo084 commented · Mar 20 at 05:53 PM

Yes, here is also seems to go at DCL instead of de discharge power set in the Dynamic ESS settings.

VRM ID: c0619ab4b45a

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axel-koning meyo084 commented · Mar 20 at 05:59 PM

I am on 3.30 since yesterdag. Also discharging to bms limit of 150A instead of 5kW battery limit DESS.

Also in Cerbo feedinlimit shows always active, also when switched off

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ meyo084 commented · Mar 20 at 06:48 PM

Have you read https://www.victronenergy.com/live/drafts:dynamic_ess#qwhy_does_the_system_exceed_the_configured_power ?

During the configuration of the system, you are setting the capacity of the system, not the actual limits of the system. These capacities are used by the system to make its calculations, so it used as an average power the system can do in an hour.

If you need to limit the import configured power, you can configure import and export AC current limits via the Settings → ESS menu in the GX.

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Jeroen Peters Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 07:15 PM

That's strange, because it used to work properly during the Venus OS 3.30 beta phase. It would calculate a SOC target based on the DESS power input and charge of discharge at the power to get to the target by the end of the hour.

Moreover I don't want to use the peak shaving function to set my battery optimization limits. I want to peakshave based on the maximum current my grid connection can handle which is much higher than what I want to use for trading energy.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Jeroen Peters commented · Mar 20 at 07:39 PM

If I recall correctly, the (dis)charging became a bit more aggressive in one of the more recent beta updates. With the reasoning that it is better to reach the target early than not at all during an hourly slot.
But we will take a closer look at both sites to check if some adjustments need to be made.

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frantiseksobotka Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 08:02 PM

Hello, Jeroen is right. The DESS limits for trading has to be fully respected. The ESS limits for grid feed-in and import current should be used only in case that battery is 100% to avoid PV power reduction or in case low SOC and high power consuption.

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meyo084 Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 21 at 10:21 AM

So if I understand correctly, do I now need to make a setting in my Cerbo to achieve the same result for a function that worked fine during the beta period? However, do I need to purchase a Victron-approved meter for this? And what are these limits in the DESS settings still used for? The system worked perfectly for me until it transitioned to production.

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delusional112 meyo084 commented · Mar 23 at 08:10 AM

Same here, I have DVCC on max 210 amp. And the settings in DESS on 6 KW. Then it discharges over 270 AMP and I get overload warnings on the phases.

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electronicsuk commented · Mar 23 at 08:31 AM

I tried Dynamic ESS on Beta a couple of months ago but as it kept exporting PV instead of charging my batteries, I switched it off. Today I updated my GX to the latest firmware, updated to the latest ESS assistant and re-enabled Dynamic ESS. I can't understand why, when I get paid nothing for export, DESS is exporting 1300W to the grid rather than using it to charge the battery. Yes, there is plenty of PV forecast for later in the day, but what if the forecast is wrong? Why waste all that power?

Even stranger is that the battery is lower than the target SoC, so I'd expect it to be charging right now. Unless 62% is where it wants to be at the end of the hour?

I'll persevere with it for a few days and see how things go, but when import prices are high all day and export is not paid, surely the goal should be to hit 100% battery charge as soon as possible? Then, if PV output is lower than forecast or loads are higher than forecast, there is some spare change in the bank, so to speak!

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kositch electronicsuk commented · Mar 23 at 10:25 AM

It behaves exactly the same for me, even when I set export price = 0 it sometimes during day (usually at the beginning) start selling the PV power to the grid even though battery is discharged to 40%. I have some rules to power on water boiler when battery SoC exceeds the 93/95/97 % of SoC (each level for each phase) so I would preffer DESS to charge the battery "full" before doing any export to the grid. I dont wont to turn off the grid export, because when water is heated and battery full I want to sell electricity, but only in that case. Not sure if there will be some change in future tu enable this. I know a lot of installations, when they cant use DESS because of this behaviour of "not charging battery to full" as the priority :/

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electronicsuk kositch commented · Mar 23 at 11:03 PM

This evening it's even charging from the grid at peak rate, because the plentiful solar during the day wasn't put into the battery. It's exactly the same problem as in the beta release. I'll see if @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) has any suggestions but if it keeps doing this after a couple more days then it's going to have to be switched off and I'll go back to scheduled charge levels, as at this rate it'll be costing me more running DESS than without it.

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kositch electronicsuk commented · Mar 24 at 07:25 AM

Yes, same for me, not sure if I have something wrong, but it sells at the beginning of the day the PV power instead of storing it to batteries and when sun goes down during the day and battery is not charged at the target SoC it start buying expensive energy in the evening to charge the battery :-(

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ electronicsuk commented · Mar 25 at 09:30 AM

By the looks of it you've now set "Can you sell energy back to the grid?" to no, which would be the advice I'd otherwise have given you.
That being said, I've made a not that we should make a more clear setting for this type of sites.

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electronicsuk Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 25 at 08:04 PM

Thanks! For those of us who don't get paid for exporting back to the grid, the priorities for DESS should be:

Put all excess PV into the batteries
Don't care too much about meeting a specific target state-of-charge level when discharging, it's better to empty the battery than buy from grid at high rates
Only use the grid for charging during cheap rates, and leave enough space in the batteries for tomorrow's forecast PV.

Of course, I appreciate that's easier said than done as everyone has their own wishes for how DESS should work!

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karkas Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 26 at 11:01 AM

I have the exact same Problem as @kositch described. Solar Energy is feed into the grid in the morning when SOC is at ~40% and later on the same day Battery is charged from Grid for 2 or 3 times of the Price of the Solar Power... I just don´t understand the calculation here. is there maybe a problem with smaler installations around the 5kwp Solar power and 4.8 kwh Battery size? (My VRM ID is 48e7da891c1f)

Your Advice on turning off "sell energy back to grid", will that completly disable feeding into the grid or just removing it from calculation? @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

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grua karkas commented · Mar 26 at 11:21 AM

As Dirk-Jan mentioed here, this should be better in some weeks:

https://community.victronenergy.com/comments/272031/view.html

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alex-itcus commented · Mar 25 at 03:38 PM

My last 7 days experience with DESS on Zonneplan with a 5KWh battery was very frustrating. I gave it a chance to be better every day, hopping. Unfortunately it sticks to some (bad) rules:
1. It sells to grid solar most of the day delaying battery charge. From the first day I disabled the sell price and battery cost hopping to start charging the battery sooner. Not a chance.
2. It starts the charge of the battery mostly in the last 2 of sun hours even if it is obvious it will not be able to charge to 100%. Even so, during those hours is charging at random speeds (1-3Ah at times, even idle) and at some point it goes on full throttle. Then as the price gets up and as soon as the sun goes down goes full charging at the high price from grid.
Like ”Uuups! I forgot to charge!”
Ex. A day with 5 hours at 18c and full solar charged 0.4 on solar all day then at the end of the day 3KWh from grid at 24c then 26c just to discharge them in the next hours at 26-28c.
My system: v3.40~1 MP2 48/5000/70 - 5KWh battery - 4.3KW solar - 2x 112 sensors one for the grid and one for the solar on AC-Out1

Today the initial plan was to sell at 0 cost solar to grid (!) and delay start charging around 13:00 and go 55% and so on, all the time less than the 2Kwh per hour limit I set. Now, after 15KWh of solar sold to grid it kept the battery at 34% until 15:00. It was obvious the battery will never be charged and I will pay the full price of 0.37 for the evening so I disabled DESS and start charging the battery on ESS mode.

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grua alex-itcus commented · Mar 25 at 06:46 PM

I also think at start of solar production FIRST the battery should be charged, and AFTER this PV surpluss can be sold. Not vice versa.

I also observed this very often.

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David Jecoby grua commented · Jul 27 at 03:38 PM

I also think at start of solar production FIRST the battery should be charged, and AFTER this PV surpluss can be sold. Not vice versa.

I also observed this very often with autoclicker?

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mryoshii commented · Mar 26 at 12:25 PM

Am I understanding something wrong?
DESS is not charging at the lowest price. It also shows solar to battery, even tho I don't have solar installed at the moment. I will keep monitoring the situation, but this doesn't seem right.

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nwametze commented · Apr 08 at 09:20 PM

About the menu-option ‘Self-consumption from battery' with the choice ‘all system loads’ or ‘only critica loads’.

Wondering why an external energymeter is mandatory if the multiplus is connected between grid and all loads. The multiplus does measure all values, so why the need for an external energy meter before this option in the menu becomes available?

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kositch commented · Apr 16 at 04:18 AM

Some of the things on our todo list:

Maximizing battery charge by the end of the day to cover consumption until sunrise
Periodically fully charge the battery to improve battery life
Adding support for varying service fees based on the time of day
Allowing users to enter a fixed schedule for grid-battery restrictions
Supporting fixed prices that change on the half-hour instead of the whole hour
Introducing (smart) support for high-consumption loads such as EV charging and heat pumps

When can we expect this to be implemented into the VRM DESS? At least that possibility to decide if we want to prefer battery charging and dynamic prices schedules for entering different formulas to specific hours?

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ronaldt commented · Jun 07 at 04:18 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) It seems that the system is not receiving any new price info anymore. It is after 18 o'clock and it is still only the info of today. We had this before (2 months ago?) and then you fixed it. Is this the same general issue, or is it just my system? (c0619ab2e756)

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john245 ronaldt commented · Jun 07 at 04:49 PM

Also on my system (The Netherlands). The issue is with ENTSOE. But I was under the impression that Victron Energy introduced a redundant data provider.

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Johan john245 commented · Jun 07 at 05:03 PM

Same to me.

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ronaldt ronaldt commented · Jun 08 at 02:42 AM

It still has the old information, so now DESS is deciding on what to do based on yesterdays prices. I think I need to switch it off...

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onur-b ronaldt commented · Jun 08 at 05:30 AM

I now see today’s prices (I removed the energy tax from the sell price —hence the difference) but the system has not yet created the plan.

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simonyoungtree onur-b commented · Jun 08 at 06:49 AM

Same problem for me: no plan available.

I also had the VRM error No Matching schedule available, but for some reason it has been cleared. But it is not working yet.

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onur-b ronaldt commented · Jun 07 at 06:27 PM

I have Tibber (NL) and no price info for tomorrow is visible.

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kudos50 ronaldt commented · Jun 08 at 08:09 AM

Same here. No schedule. Fixes itself every now and then but only for an hour. Prices for today are in but no plan.

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Jarco van Roest (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ kudos50 commented · Jun 08 at 08:57 AM

Hi all, should be fixed now. Two issues compounded into this;

1. We didn't receive prices from our primary price provider yesterday, that switched over to a secondary one. We've contacted the primary one in case they don't have prices for tomorrow either, but we're monitoring the situation.

2. The server generating the schedules had an outage, which has been resolved as well.

Sorry for the inconvenience, hope all is well and you can make full use of negative prices and the shining sun today!

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john245 Jarco van Roest (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented · Jun 08 at 09:10 AM

I assume the schedules will be created at the top of the hour. Here currently no schedule.

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Johan john245 commented · Jun 08 at 01:41 PM

price is there, 1 point fixed. schedule still missing. so im not the only one.

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chrizzp commented · Mar 20 at 10:15 PM

Subject: Using energy from PV inverter to charge battery

For the last two weeks i've been running Dynamic DSS. It works great! There is one thing though i was wondering.

I've got a 3kw PV inverter (via em24) and 3kw of PV chargers. When the sun shines and the dynamic price is low. The battery is being charged by the PV chargers. Occasionally the grid is used for additional charging. The Target SOC has not been above 80% although we had some sunny days recently.

Effectively the PV inverter is pumping into the grid (costing 2ct per kw provider profit) and occasionally the multiplus is drawing current (costing 2ct per kw provider profit)

If the multiplus would use the production of the PV inverter to charge the battery (or the fraction needed to reach the target) the energy would be consumed internally and not registered by the providers meter.

Efficiency and cost wise it should be prioritised like:

1) PV charger

2) PV inverter

3) grid

Is this the way it is implemented? if so, any reason that i'm not seeing this behaviour?

thanks!

ID c0619ab2e85a

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ronaldt chrizzp commented · Mar 21 at 07:04 AM

My guess is that this happens because the system is quite strict on the target SOC. So if you use more than expected (switch on the coffeemachine e.g.) you need energy from the grid to get to the target SOC. If the loads are lower, then you would overshoot the target SOC and PV is dumped to the grid. It would be much nicer to have the SOC more dynamic. If it can not be reached the so be it. When there is more PV, lucky me, put it in the battery!

I wish I am wrong on this, but I a afraid I am not. But also remember, this is the first official release of dynamic ESS and it is doing a lot of things really nice.

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kudos50 chrizzp commented · Mar 25 at 07:58 AM

As far as I know, DESS currently does not interpret PV inverter and PV charger differently. It's all solar and it's all calculated based on the round-trip efficiency percentage (losses) you can configure for your setup.

As PV charger does not experience any losses and PV inverter does, the ~20% losses for all PV are not realistic and many scenario's exist where it is more efficient to dump PV inverter but store PV charger.

Users that only have PV inverter are good with the efficiency setting, users that only have PV charger are good setting it to zero. It's the ones that have both that are affected.

Not on the todo list.

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chrizzp kudos50 commented · Mar 29 at 01:13 PM

Thanks for the answer!

However, if it is not interpreted differently as you state. Why is the power of the inverter not used to charge my battery?

Lets take a look at the situation today.

Time 13:55. The SOC is far below the target. Sell price is negative. There is plenty of solar power from the inverter. I do not understand why it is being dumped. Obviously this is costing money, so efficiency loss in case of charging the battery is no issue.

If the setup would function as regular ESS, i.e. keeping the grid input/output around zero, all would be optimal.

This is not logic is it?

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kudos50 chrizzp commented · Apr 28 at 08:07 PM

Nope, you are right. But with my setup there is no way I can reproduce what is in your screenshots unless ESS is trying to recover from low-soc condition. That is the only moment in which the MPPT RS is charging the battery whilst PV inverters can be feeding into grid.

All other use-cases for me will end up in AC and DC PV doing the same thing. Either inverting to grid or loads, or charging the battery.

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charlesb commented · Mar 24 at 03:15 PM

Is it possible to add minutes to the Fixed Tariff? For example, Octopus Intelligent Go in the United Kingdom is from 2330 until 0530 for a low rate. Even 30-minute rates would be good! Looks good and I tried setting it up, but this stops me from using as the car will exhaust the battery ... Many thanks!

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br3tt charlesb commented · Mar 25 at 12:47 AM

Request for 30 min rates was fed back during DESS beta launch video last year.

For anyone in UK wanting more granular control, recommend checking out:
Home page - GbbOptimizer (gbbsoft.pl)

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ charlesb commented · May 27 at 08:45 AM

We got it implemented to the point that we'd like one or 2 beta testers from the UK that can test it for us. If you are willing to do that, please leave your VRM id and I'll contact you via mail afterwards.

Tagging @CharlesB , but other UK users are also welcome to respond.

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charlesb Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 17 at 07:52 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Thanks very much for this - now trying out the 30-minute slots. It will be interesting to see how it works on the Intelligent Octopus Go tariff where the car is charged between 2330 and 0530 at home at times of their choosing. It looks good - and the prediction is better than the one I used on Home Assistant.

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m1kkel Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 12 at 10:59 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Can i also test this? Im from DK and have heavily tariffs between 17:00 to 21:00, which is so much i cant use DESS right now since its not account for the differences in the tariffs, which is a factor 5 throughout the day.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ m1kkel commented · Jun 12 at 06:06 PM

Well, this part of the thread is on UK half hour updates, which seems unrelated to your wish.
Can you tell me a bit more about what goes wrong when you enable Dynamic ESS? Your battery seems big enough to cover that part of the day.

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givenmotorsport Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 13 at 10:26 AM

Hiya, I dont know if your still looking for testers in the UK. I am on Octopus Agile and would like to use DEES. i'm currently using Node-red to schedule some fairly fixed charging schedules, which I change every few days depending on the pricing and how much Solar I am forecasted to get. My VRM ID is c0619ab56b5b

Ta.

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kdjuflusd commented · Mar 31 at 05:47 PM

Dear Victron (Community),

I think the idea of Dynamic-ESS is great, but I'm having problems with the current implementation - or maybe I'm misunderstanding it.

Problem 1: The forecast in cloudy weather is very bad and therefore the prediction is almost wrong. It seems that Victron generally assumes a cloudless sky. Is it not possible to include hourly cloud cover to improve the forecast?

Problem 2: When I switch on Dynamic-ESS, my battery is hardly charged at all until the afternoon. All solar yields are sold almost exclusively to the grid (from the morning tiull early afernoon). In the afternoon, it often no longer manages to reach the desired SOC and sometimes recharges 10-20% of the battery capacity from the grid. This happens several days in a row (and on these days I have sold 100-500% of the battery capacity to the grid in the morning).

Problem 3: When Dynamic-ESS is switched on, the Multiplus discharges the battery at a very low level (usually around 20-50W discharge in the morning) in the morning till it decide to load the battery. This makes almost no difference to the SOC, but switching off the inverter completely in this constellation would save a lot more energy, as around 10% of our home's normal load is wasted on the unused inverter due to unproductive discharging.

Perhaps others have also observed this and can give me a tip.

Boundary conditions - Germany, constant tariff for feed-in and consumption.

Portal ID c0619ab4d1ac

Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

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kdjuflusd kdjuflusd commented · Mar 31 at 05:59 PM

enough power in the morning and loading from grid in the evening...

Inverter turned on although there is nothing planned to do. Here it would be better either load the batterie and/or shutdown inverter to save energy (it do the same even when PV-Power is less so I have to buy from grid)

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kositch kdjuflusd commented · Mar 31 at 08:17 PM

Yes, same for me and the others, they have it already on ToDo list, hope that there will be some possibility to prioritize charging the battery to full before selling...

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kdjuflusd kositch commented · Mar 31 at 09:37 PM

... and turning inverter off instead of slow discharge of small 14W or something else (small values less than x Watt) ...

And perhaps include cloudiness in weather prognosis on an per hour level. When I look into my cellphone (weather.com for example for tomorrow) it is mostly very near to the reality. When 09:00 - 10:00 is sunny and 10:00 - 11:00 is cloudy then it is mostly exactly that 9-10 is very good amount of energy and 10-11 is only a small part of possible amount of energy?

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kdjuflusd kdjuflusd commented · Apr 04 at 07:18 AM

Dear Victron,

are there any plans to optimize:

1) forecast when cloudy weather is being expected?

2) disable inverter when there is only a small amount of energy being discharged (my example less than 40-80W which is ineffective because of self-consumption especially in a 3-phase ESS)

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mheinze5722 commented · Apr 03 at 09:44 AM

Another observation and comment on the objective: "Minimize cost":

The stated goal for the DESS is:

Dynamic ESS is an algorithm that aims to minimise the costs made on the grid and battery:

By scheduling charge/discharge cycles of the battery,
While taking grid limitations, battery specifications and day ahead energy prices into account,
When it can, it also considers the consumption and solar yield forecasts when scheduling.

So, as an example my "projection" from today:

I believe I can see what's happening here: The algorithm "literally" trys to minimize cost and maximise revenue... as such selling as much as possible, only adding a littlebit to the battery at the end of the day to make the battery SOC excatly meet minimum (which in my case is 15% SOC). Yes, this maximises revenue for this day, but obviously does not do what I really want: it needs to include the rest of the night (but does not at this point (8 am), because (I venture) prices for tomorrow have not been set yet. This leads to feeding all surplus into the grid, and only at the last moment charge the battery just a littlebit. It will obviously run out of SOC from midnight on, which is not what I want.

Additionally, even if it would calculate the exact need until the next morning when some PV surplus is happening again. I also want to my battery to protect against (seldom/occasional) grid outages, and in these cases I want to have as much SOC left as possible. Also, the actual consumption in the night might be occousionally higher, so I want to be prepared for that as well.

In short, that means, in my mind I have a "Default target SOC" each day that I aim to achieve. As I have LFP chemistry in my battery, I aim to charge to 100% every day. [If I had NMC chemistry, in summer, I could aim to only charge to 80% if that is easily enough to get me through the night for battery longevity].

Also, what I am doing manually right now, when charging to 100%, I aim not to charge full speedright from the morning sun, but rather limit charging speed (through DVCC/"Maximum charging speed") which helps to reduce AC->DC conversion loss and reduces the charging Ampere into the battery. Not quite sure on this, but it feels reducing charging speed of the battery helps its longevity as well. In my mind, I always try to minimize charging speed so that my battery reaches 100% SOC around 2 pm. Why 2 pm? Then it reduces my lunch peak feed-in while still having 2 pm until sun-set to fully charge my battery in case didn't fully get charged over lunch because of reduced sunlight. Obviously an algorithm running every hour so can do a much better job at this. This would help us all in reducing battery wear and lunch-peak mgmt.

So, as such, for me as a house owner (might be different from boat, RV, commercial or industrial), my stated goal for the algorithm should be:

[Text to be continued in a separate Post]

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marceldb commented · Apr 04 at 06:14 PM

There is no price schedule and no battery forecast for tomorrow at my sites and and also not at all my customer's sites. Time: 20:12

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ marceldb commented · Apr 04 at 06:46 PM

We are looking into it.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 04 at 07:31 PM

Our source (Entso-E) seems to have some problems with publishing the prices for tomorrow for the Netherlands.

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Jeroen Peters Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 05 at 04:38 AM

Thanks for quickly picking up on the issue!

The prices that are now in for today are shifted by 1 hour. For example the cheapest hour of the day is 15h-16h in DESS while EPEX website shows this is at 16h-17h.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Jeroen Peters commented · Apr 05 at 05:18 AM

Thanks for noticing. We've added the prices manually yesterday evening and probably overlooked the an hour price difference. We'll try to fix that asap.

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anonimoes marceldb commented · Apr 04 at 07:05 PM

same at my site! Has been like this since the prices should have been published.

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h8mecz commented · Apr 18 at 11:11 AM

Hello guys,

will be any posibility to choose in Dynamic ESS if you want to buy/sell energy or just to have dynamic minimum SoC according weather forecast in the future? It would be really nice feature. Because I do not care about prices - I just sell/buy energy for fixed price. Currently I am struggling in Node-RED with this (I am not so skilled in it) :(

Thanks for feedback and have a nice sunny days! ;)

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grua commented · Apr 20 at 05:16 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

we have bad weather for a few days now and the heat pump is switching on. The time pattern is always the same, the heat pump usually runs from 00:00 to approx. 06:00 at just over 2 kW. After that, the daily consumption always drops significantly:

But the consumption forecast does not recognize this pattern. It assumes that today and tomorrow there will be consistently high consumption of over 2 kW:

It is therefore assumed that consumption is significantly too high, which leads to poor planning. Is no pattern recognition implemented in the current implementation of the consumption forecast? In other words, is the temporal progression of consumption over the last few days currently not taken into account?

You wrote in the first post that the following improvement will be implemented: "Introducing (smart) support for high-consumption loads such as EV charging and heat pumps". Will this help in such cases?

VRM b827eb273733

One hour later the forecast for the current day ist a little bit better:

But for the next day it's still bad, the 2 kW consumption of the heat-pump starting at 00:00 doesn't exist at all any more:

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simonyoungtree commented · Apr 22 at 03:44 PM

Charging a car in the middle of the day completely ruines the DESS planning for the remainder of day and the next day.

The original plan was to dump the battery at high prices (end of the day), but when the carging completed an hour before the end of the day, the picture was completely different: the systems just assumes to feed consumption from the battery. And since the huge consumption is no longer there, at least a complete hour of high prices will be missed by not dumping to the grid.

Also the picture for the next day is completely ruined by a charging session:

Perhaps it is possible to modify the consumption planning algorithm, to just take the deviation from long term consumption as granted, but do not assume the same will be happening for any next hours.

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grua simonyoungtree commented · Apr 22 at 04:47 PM

similar here: https://community.victronenergy.com/articles/270649/dynamic-ess-on-vrm.html?childToView=278732#comment-278732

But as mentioned by Dirk-Jan in the first post of this thread, the following is planed to be implemented: "Introducing (smart) support for high-consumption loads such as EV charging and heat pumps"

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simonyoungtree grua commented · Apr 22 at 05:41 PM

Changing the consumption planning to not include the current day consumption should not be that difficult to implement.

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sarowe simonyoungtree commented · May 01 at 08:52 AM

Oder die Gewichtung des langfristigen Verbrauchs im Verhältnisse zum Verbrauchshoch anders gestalten

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frantiseksobotka commented · Apr 22 at 09:18 PM

Hello,

after many trials and following of the all comunity from the beginning of DESS, I decided 3 days ago to install node-red and try the latest possibilities.

I am very happy that there is already possible to swich on "green mode" and to define second SOC limit (b_goal SOC @ b_goal hour). Seems that there is good improvement, but nevertheless I would like to report some troubles that I can observe. Just smal info - at my instalation at the moment no unexpected consuptions as car charging, water heater or heat pump.

1. I do not fully understand to option green mode:

The system still feeds from battery to grid from battery. Which is not according to description in the node-red, but on the other hand is fine from me, it is from solar excess production. Would be nice to have better expain in documentation.

2. I have at the moment clearly lot of excess solar power, nevertheless the system is time to time during export time!!! stopping export, stopping use of battery and start to use grid to power the consuption. Further more to start to charge the battery!

This just today caused that more than 50% of the export earning is lost in the pointless power import.

3. The energy consumption from the grid is not shown at the DESS node-red system neither at the VRM graphs:

4. Yesterday night when there was yet "green option off" the system was in contrary with the plan exporting still ~500w during night. That was maybe cause why the system was under the (b_goal SOC @ b_goal hour). System started to use grid and start to charge battery from the grid, nevetheless was still above minSOC.

Hepefully this can help you or you can help me :)

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ronaldt frantiseksobotka commented · Apr 23 at 04:55 AM

I have installed Node Red 0.1.19 as well. But in my case I see no difference in behaviour anymore when checking or unchecking green mode. Does that work on your system?
Furtermore it does not follow the target SOC anymore. Which is a good thing because it doesn't sell at the highest price anymore (see chart below). Now I tried to switch to VRM DESS but I do not get the charts anymore on VRM.
So I am a bit confused.

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frantiseksobotka ronaldt commented · Apr 23 at 05:55 AM

I do not se at the moment difference if green mode is on-off neither.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ frantiseksobotka commented · Apr 23 at 09:07 AM

Yes, there seems to be a bug here. I'll fix it and release an update today.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 23 at 02:03 PM

Update is out (v0.1.20) https://github.com/victronenergy/dynamic-ess/releases/tag/v0.1.20

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frantiseksobotka frantiseksobotka commented · Apr 23 at 06:22 AM

Bit more observation from last day-night for the 2nd point - system is stopping to use the battery and use grid instead or charge during export time....

From the AC input power graph you can observe that the problem occures always only during grid feed-in time and exactly at the change of the whole hour.

At the 2nd picture there is shown one of the event. You can se that at the end of the hour, system stops feed in and probably due to SOC under target it starts to feed from grid or recharge battery. With new hour and new schedule for SOC it is gone and the system works fine. So I believe that this issue comes only during end of hour slot.

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smejfi commented · Apr 27 at 01:24 PM

Dear @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy), might I dare to ask when does Victron plan to release some updated version of Dynamic ESS? I think that all the complaints about the current (non)functionality have been thousand times mentioned here and Im pretty sure you know about them all. As for me, the most bothering seems to be the fact that in the end of the day the battery is drained to the minimum which causes that system takes all the (expensive) energy from the grid untill the solar production in the morning starts to be enough to power the loads. You claim that system aims to minimize the total energy costs, but with my setup (15kWp on Fronius Symo 15 with 3x MP-II 5000 and 58kWh battery) in this part of a year, I wouldnt need to take any energy from the grid (which works with standard ESS very well) and there is even plenty of energy left to feed into the grid. But with current version of Dynamic ESS the system actually ends up taking quite a lot of energy from the grid during the night which of course results in much larger costs than when DESS is turned off.

My company installs Victron equipment in residential buildings and boats and I have always claimed that Victron is the best, but in this case I must confess that Im a little dissapointed that with such major issues in functionality Victron released the official version of DESS...while in beta version this would be completely understandable, the official version should not in my opinion have such issues. Thank you in advance for the answer.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ smejfi commented · Apr 27 at 02:21 PM

We are indeed aware of the current limitations and have been busy fixing them. You can expect an update and new post within 2 weeks. If you can't wait that long, you can already test with the improvements by using the Node-RED implementation (https://github.com/victronenergy/dynamic-ess).

As a side note, I noticed that your system does has the inverter on the AC output side and is running version v3.30. I advice you to update to the latest v3.31 release. That update fixes a bug where for these type of systems the energy sometimes flowed into the grid instead of the battery. That will probably already help.

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frantiseksobotka Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 27 at 06:44 PM

Sorry to say that, but current node-red version does not improve the grid usage a lot. Still there is a lot of grid usage every hour, also before sunset. I tried green mode, also several setups with new limit at defined hour. But till today I do not know how is possible to setup system which will stop trading at defined SOC and will continue to use battery till defined minSOC.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ frantiseksobotka commented · Apr 28 at 02:49 PM

Would you be so kind to file an issue about that on github? I took a short look at your site and don't see that much grid usage (when you had it switched on). Please add the time it, in your opinion, made the wrong choice, so we can check.

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frantiseksobotka Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 29 at 08:42 AM

Hello, thank for the feedback, I describe issue at github. The issue was on 22.-23.4. almost every end of hour during grid feed-in time slots. I re-enabled large instalation, so I am ready to swich on again if needed to reproduce it.

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smejfi Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 28 at 09:33 PM

Thank you for the information and advice for an update, I must admit that today the system worked quite well, except absolutely unnecessary grid ussage at 19:00-19:59

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frantiseksobotka smejfi commented · Apr 27 at 06:27 PM

fully agree

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Jeroen Peters commented · May 01 at 08:33 PM

Today had two net negative priced hours in the Netherlands. In these hours I curtailed the output from my two AC connected PV inverters to maximize charging from the grid.

To my suprise the batteries stopped charging within minutes and didn't charge for the rest of these two hours. It seems the system is not able to deal with curtailment, which is a bit unfortunate with the quickly growing amount of negative priced hours. Could this be fixed?

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kudos50 Jeroen Peters commented · May 03 at 08:20 AM

Maybe double check settings like "allow charging from grid?". Other than that, stopping production should not interfere with a charge plan. I stopped Enphase production and did not have any issues. MPPT RS kept charging and Multi's also kept charging (buying)

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sarowe commented · May 14 at 10:38 AM

Ich muss nochmal etwas auf Deutsch loswerden. Ich bin seit vielen Monaten hier aktiv am Testen des DESS. Ich habe über so manche Anfangsfehler weggesehen und war immer der Hoffnung, dass es irgendwann richtig läuft. Ich habe es jetzt deaktiviert!!!!!!! Es gibt nach meiner Ansicht noch eine große Baustelle, bei den Verbrauchsprognosen. Ich hatte oft den Eindruck, es habe sich etwas verbessert, aber letztlich ist es so für mich nicht praxistauglich. Ich möchte ein paar Gedanken dazu formulieren, die vielleicht berücksichtigt werden.

- Wenn große Lasten, wie das E-Auto geladen oder Kochen in Betrieb sind, geht die Prognose extrem hoch und zwar für die nächsten 12-24 Stunden. Das ist völlig unrealistisch und wird in der Praxis selten so vorkommen. Wenn die Prognose für die nächste Stunde hoch geht, wäre das OK, aber nicht für den ganzen Zeitintervall. Im Gegenteil, der Ladevorgang des Autos ist dann für diesen Tag erledigt. Ähnlich beim Essen Kochen oder ähnlichen Verbrauchern.

-Der durchschnittliche tägliche oder auch wöchentliche Verbrauch sollte Einfluss haben und die Prognose müsste viel mehr auf diese Durchschnittswerte zurückgreifen. Die meisten E-Autos dürften eine annähernd gleiche wöchentliche Fahrleistung haben. Auch wenn ich Montag und Mittwoch lade, ist die Wahrscheinlichkeit, dass das Auto am Donnerstag völlig leer ist, gering. Andersherum wenn 3 Tage nicht geladen wurde ist die Wahrscheinlichkeit sehr groß, dass ein hoher Verbrauch ansteht. Beim Kochen oder Wäschewaschen sollten ähnliche Regelmäßigkeiten berücksichtigt werden.

-viele uns betreiben mittlerweile aktives Lastmanagement. Das heißt, wenn der Strom entweder besonders günstig ist oder viel über PV produziert wird, geht der Verbrauch nach oben. Ich habe das Gefühl, eine solche Logik berücksichtigt der jetzige Algorythmus überhaupt nicht. Für mich wäre es daher logisch, dass der Algorithmus noch andere Parameter als Wochentag, Uhrzeit, aktueller und durchschnittlicher Verbrauch berücksichtigt. Interessante Parameter wären auch Ein-/Verkaufspreis (jedenfalls extreme Unterschiede), PV Überschuss, Akku Soc und anderes.

Ich hoffe, meine Vorschläge werden nicht als pprinzipielle Kritik aufgefasst, sondern als konstruktive Vorschläge.

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Andi sarowe commented · May 20 at 07:45 AM

Bin ich voll und ganz bei dir. Schade das auf solche Beiträge nicht auch mal vom Team geantwortet wird.

Ich habe auch noch immer das Problem, das wenn mal 2-3 Tage Pisswetter angesagt ist, und ein Preis von 17cent, das DESS nicht gewillt ist den Akku mal von 20% auf 50-60% vollzumachen.

Ich glaube auch das es nichts mehr wird mit dem DESS. Die Idee fand ich aber gut.

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sarowe sarowe commented · May 21 at 10:49 AM

Ja so langsam ärgere ich mich auch über etwas. Ich finde die Ansätze und die bisher geleistete Arbeit großartig. Mich verwundert etwas, dass diese offensichtlich herschenden Mängel so schwierig zu beheben sind. Ich habe den Fortschritt sehr lange beobachtet und war mir eigentlich sicher, dass der endgültige Durchbruch gelingt.

Schade.

Ich werde das DESS erstmal deaktiviert lassen und etwas abwarten was passiert. Momentan ist es für mich nicht elementar.

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Peter sarowe commented · May 14 at 09:23 PM

Maybe it is time to try DESS alternative? ;-)

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sarowe Peter commented · May 15 at 03:24 AM

Nein.....mit Sicherheit nicht

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janosch commented · May 27 at 10:28 PM

Als, erst mal Danke, dass Victron kontinuierlich an der Implementierung/Verbesserung von Dynamic ESS arbeitet. Gerade mit der Aufteilung in den Green Mode / Trading Mode können die verschiedenen Anwendungen von DSS besser in den Griff bekommen werden.Doch ich hab ein paar Bitten

- Bitte berechnet die voraussichtliche Akkulevel für die nächsten 7 Tage (und nicht nur für die kommenden 24h) und stellt dies in dem entsprechenden Diagramm dar
- Bitte schaut nehmt Euch (endlich) auch der Verbesserung Berechnung des „Vorraussichtlichen Verbrauchs“ an. Wenn dies nicht zufriedenstellend allgemein (für alle) gelöst werden kann dann gebt uns Anwendern bitte die Chance ein für uns entsprechendes Modell (mittelwert über die letzten 2 / 4 / 12 … Wochen auszuwählen.
Der derzeitige Algorithmus ist IMO eine absolute Zumutung. Und wenn ich den langen Thread hier lese nicht nur für ich)

Beispiele:

Der Verbrauch ist immer >1,8KWh/Tag

Nicht jedoch in der derzeitigen Vorausschau

Update: dann die Verbrauchs-Vorhersage eine Stunde später:

noch unbrauchbarer :-(

und die Vorraussage des stündlichen Verbrauchs (immer > 50W/h )

(ich hab leider keinen Screenshot von dem anderen Extrems, wo auf einmal ein Verbrauch dreifachen des normalen täglichen Verbrauchs für die nächsten 7 Tage angezeigt wird. (Meist, nachdem an einem Tag mal aussergewöhnlich viel verbraucht wurde)

(Ich passe mein Verhalten (Manuelles Netz-nachladen, größere Verbräuche ) ein wenig der Vorhersage an, doch dies sollte mit einem Mittelwert pro der letzten 4 bzw 12 Wochen für einen pro Wochentag halbwegs passen.

Die derzeitige Implementierung ist eine Zumutung, und für mich der Grund Dynamic ESS meister ausgeschaltet zu haben,
(Diese bewirkt leider auch, dass die Ladezustandsberechnung (fast) nicht mehr aktualisiert wird.
Bitte gebt uns eine Möglichkeit, dass auch bei deaktivierter DESS der Ladezustand für eine möglichst lange Zeit (>>24h) vorberechnet wird .

Trotzdem Vielen Dank an Euer Team, denn vieles läuft echt gut bei Euch, und irgendwann ist auch Dynamic-ESS mal wirklich anwendbar ;-)

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christopha commented · Jun 26 at 07:02 AM

Hi, it seems that the prices I See in VRM do not reflect the actual price I have to pay:

While VRM shows me around 18ct, Awattar asks for almost 2€ :-)

My settings should be fine:

I won't import energy today but it would be quite bad to not have exact pricing when relying on imports.

Best regards Christoph

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grua christopha commented · Jun 26 at 09:05 AM

awattar Website:

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christopha grua commented · Jun 27 at 06:04 AM

Thanks, I later also read that information. But it seems like VRM and awattar are not using the same data (EPEX spot), which would be nice.

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falkon commented · Jun 26 at 01:16 PM

Hi, I am sharing another 2 instances of the wrong DESS decisions, which actually costs money:

buying from grid to "shave peak" instead of using battery power
buying from grid to catch-up target SoC, instead of "waiting for solar to finish charging"

It seems to be, that it takes SELL Dynamic price to decide if buying from grid instead of BUY FIXED prices. Maybe this is not a common situation in your testing cases, thus I pointing it out:

I have plain FIXED BUY price (pretty high) -- the same price no matter the time or date
I have DYNAMIC SELL price (significantly lower than the buying price)
DESS was in configured in the TRADE mode, battery Restrictions were turned OFF
I have pretty large system, able to run in off-grid mode

Situation 1: BUYING from Grid to cover internal consumption instead of using battery power:

morning, 6:30, some cofee and tea machines turned on, the peak consumption goes to 2.5 kW, while the Solar production is "just" ~400W.
DESS plan was to keep battery at 52% SoC until around 10:00, when it wanted to start slowly charging
----------
Expected behavior: the consumption peaks will be covered from battery power (because the SoC > Minimum SoC). If the battery SoC decreases below the target, it will be recharged afterwards from Solar limiting selling to Grid for a low price
Observed behavior: the consumption peaks were covered from Grid, buying for high price (0.28 buy vs. 0.10 sell), making unnecessary spending.

Situation 2: BUYING from Grid to catch-up SoC plan instead of waiting for Solar to recharge batteries

Afternoon, starting from ~13:22. The DESS plan is to recharge the batteries to Full because the selling price is the lowest (the plan itself is good)
Feed-IN to grid was correctly stopped at 13:00
Unfortunatelly, some clouds came in, and the Solar production between 13:00-13:20 was lower than predicted (still, solar production ~3000 W, while consumption was just ~500W, so Battery Power was around ~2500W -- batteries were nicely and steadily charging, though not as fast as DESS has predicted).
-----
Expected behavior: the charging will continue at a natural Solar-production pace, Feed-In to grid will be stopped "a little longer" to compensate for clouds and slower charging pace [see Fig. 3]
Observed behavior: the system decided to take additional power from the grid, even though the BUY price is high (0.28), and there is NOT any other time point where the bought energy can be sell back for the higher price. [see Fig. 4]

My guess is, that somewhere in the implementation there is a mistake, that it incorrectly calculates with DYNAMIC SELLING prices instead of FIXED BUYING prices to decide when to buy from the grid.

This example happened on 26.6.2024. My VRM ID = c0619ab5fb1b

Please see the attached screnshots for getting grasp on what was going on

(EDIT: for some reason I can not upload images, it tells me "No link in upload response" :( ).

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falkon falkon commented · Jun 26 at 06:21 PM

Fig. 1: Situation 1, time 6:20.

Fig. 2:

Fig. 3: Situation 2, time 13:48.

Fig. 4:

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fdues commented · Mar 20 at 03:07 PM

Hi, i also cant activate it. VRM ID c0619ab4bbc2

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ fdues commented · Mar 20 at 03:17 PM

@duivert & @FDues : You need your GX to update to firmware v3.30 first. I'll update the documentation to make this more clear.

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Duivert NL Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 03:22 PM

thank you!

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sharpener Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 07:46 PM

I have updated to v3.40~1 but I cannot see this screen anywhere to set the grid current limits as per the manual:

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ sharpener commented · Mar 20 at 08:07 PM

You don't seem to have an energy meter in your system. The system needs to know what the actual currents are before it can adjust itself based on these readings. Which is why you will need to have one in your setup before you can see (and adjust) these settings.

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sharpener Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 08:56 PM

Thanks for looking. But since I have nothing connected on AC-IN does the internal CT in the Multi not provide the same information?

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prein commented · Mar 20 at 03:42 PM

I think it is unlogic to charge the battery between 14 and 15 and discharge The same bit between 18-19 given the price scheme..

Id c0619ab39902

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max-payne prein commented · Mar 20 at 04:28 PM

Yeah the dynamic ESS should take all 1 hour blocks and sort them in descended order by profit - and fill those hours first and foremost.

It should look 48 hours ahead and plan such that most profit can be achieved in that timeframe within the limits of the system.

Maybe that means charging at night on the weekend and holding off until monday morning.

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prein max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 04:52 PM

It's quite complex of course, but in this situation, where the sun is less than expected. The better choice would be to not charge the battery to target SoC, but recalculate and export less to grid at 18.00 (or 19 or 20)..

I deliberately set the sell price lower to prevent too much trading (the noise from the multiplusses is too close to the living room in this case). I understand the battery must be emptied at the best hour, so discharging to grid at 18 is ok, but buying extra for 7ct and then selling it back for 7cts is a waste of money

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Barbara (Victron Energy) ♦ max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 06:16 PM

Unfortunately scheduling ahead 48 hours is impossible, considering the ENTO-E day ahead prices only roll in the early afternoon each day.

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Barbara (Victron Energy) ♦ prein commented · Mar 20 at 06:25 PM

To limit this behavior, I would advice to put a reasonable battery cost in the configuration. If the algorithm expects there's no cost attached to charging/discharging a battery, it will favor that, even if the profit is minor.

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grua Barbara (Victron Energy) ♦ commented · Mar 20 at 08:41 PM

or disable "discharge battery to grid"

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prein Barbara (Victron Energy) ♦ commented · Mar 21 at 06:35 AM

Set the battery costs to 0.02 and the behavior is now that it sends Al the solar to grid. Next I am going to try to include other costs in the price formula to make the energy price higher. I just put the raw price in, since all other costs will also be subtracted when returning to grid..

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max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 04:12 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Great now make it like go-e charger and add dynamic pricing information for Awattar!

I see its missing.
Simple formula:

(EPEX SPOT AUT * 1,03 + ,0,015) * 1,2
Quote of Awattar:

Stündliche Preise EPEX Spot ® AT +
| Stündliche Preise EPEX Spot ® AT | * 0.03 (3%)
+ 1,500 Cent/kWh

Oh I see its there with another name already ;)

Please add Awattar. Seems like a copy paste job for smart energy.

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Barbara (Victron Energy) ♦ max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 06:17 PM

Thank you for providing this, we'll add it!

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grua max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 08:57 PM

Attention: aWATTar calculates 3% of the absolute value of the price! This means that the part of the formula "p * 1.03" is only correct if the purchase price is positive, which is normally the rule.

But there are always phases of negative purchase prices. And therefore this part of the formula must correctly be as follows: "p + ABS(p) * 0.03".

As DESS does not yet allow an absolute value, negative purchase prices cannot yet be correctly taken into account in aWATTar!

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ grua commented · Mar 22 at 03:27 PM

That 'abs()' functionality should be there. But only on positions where the formula allows it. If you have issues with that, just tag me and I'll probably look further into it early next week.

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grua Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 22 at 03:30 PM

Ah OK, then thats new - didn't see it yet

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max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 04:22 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Second comment. VERY COOL FEATURE.

Activated it but ran into a problem:
"Battery capacity unset". I read the dynamic ESS manual fully and expected it to work.
Venus OS shows dynamic ESS in Mode AUTO. So the update works.

Is something off? Why the error?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ max-payne commented · Mar 20 at 06:19 PM

What is your vrm ID? So I can take a look at what is wrong?

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max-payne Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 20 at 08:14 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)
Thanks - I saved again but after 1hr error was back. I am aware of no error since I followed the manual and values are present in the UI. Please take a look.
VRM ID: 48e7da856f31

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ max-payne commented · Mar 21 at 07:44 AM

I don't see the cause of it right away. Can you enable "remote support" on your GX device? (You can find that in the console under Settings -> General).

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max-payne Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 21 at 08:28 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

Remote support is activated. Greetings!

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grua commented · Mar 20 at 09:15 PM

It's great that DESS has now been officially released, which will significantly increase the number of users and feedback, but will of course also cause you even more work ;-)

The most important points on your to-do list in my opinion:

Maximizing battery charge by the end of the day to cover consumption until sunrise
Periodically fully charge the battery to improve battery life

And as I had already noted in the beta phase, DESS obviously ignores the grid set point configured in the remote console. I always set the grid setpoint in ESS slightly negative (-10W) to avoid grid reference as much as possible. DESS seems to ignore this and seems to adjust to 0 W or slightly positive. This causes unnecessary expensive grid consumption over a longer period of time.

The rest: great!

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ grua commented · Mar 21 at 07:30 AM

If you were to check the dbus paths of the system, you could already notice work being done on those two points. The first point is already in a testing phase on the Node-RED implementation.

As far as the grid setpoint goes. With DESS on the ESS grid setpoint is no longer used, otherwise we'd be slowly discharging and ending at a lower SOC than the algorithm expects, and also potentially feeding energy into the grid when it is not allowed.

The system behaves as designed. Just not as you prefer it to behave.

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frantiseksobotka Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 21 at 07:44 AM

I would like to support idea of grua. As the regulation of the setpoint has certain accuracy and there is difference between sale and purchase price the the optimal (from economical point of view) stady point is not zero.

The exact optimal grid setpoint can be calculated (input should be the stability of regulation, differnece beteween sale and purchase price). Say it easy - in case that purchase energy is very espensive and there is plan to export -> move setpoint under the zero.

E.G. in Czech republic where purchese/sell price difference is high...these unvanted small purchases can consume up to 30-40% of the complete DESS earning benefit and that is huge.

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kudos50 Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 21 at 08:52 AM

Well, it maybe just my system. But slow discharging is happening anyway. With DESS active the system never seems to rest at night whereas the setpoint remains the same for hours. It almost continuesly consumes between 50 and 80W from the battery.

I do have peak shaving set to always but it's hardly ever needed.

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ronaldt commented · Mar 21 at 07:14 AM

Great that we have now the official release! Many small (or bigger) improvements have been made during the last couple of months with a lot of feedback via this forum and quick response from Victron @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) . Thanks!

Now for the next release :)
- Please do not be so strict on target SOC
- Able to set a minimum SOC for DESS. It is now taking the minimum SOC of the system resulting in that the batteries are empty many times for longer periods. And there is a lot of capacity to play with when it charges only up to a good 50%. See picture below. (from node-red because it gives a nicer picture to show this)

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ronaldt ronaldt commented · Mar 21 at 10:19 AM

Example below happening just now. SOC is 20. And now the sun comes around the clouds. All me precious energy is dumped for a low price to the grid. But later I buy it back because SOC says so (and use it to sell it for a higher price). For sure this is costing money.
Would it be an easy change not to sell when the price is low (like not to buy when the price is high)?

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hans818 ronaldt commented · Mar 21 at 03:48 PM

Yes here also

I hope that the DESS minium SOC can stop this, so when that is reached the selling is over and switch to ESS. But the button is grey. Is this function still active ?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ hans818 commented · Mar 22 at 02:27 PM

This is a remnant from the beta version, which we overlooked to remove from the gui. The underlying system does not use that setting.

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Rasmus Mikkelsen Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 23 at 07:21 AM

Let me ask this, my DESS minimum SoC keep defaulting to 0% even tho I try to raise it to 10-20% I ran into a problem this night where DESS ran things down to 10% because of "minimum soc unless grid fails", but now system is buying from grid to power my loads and strictly keep up the target SoC even tho there's still 10% left it shouldn't try to keep the target SoC so hard since there's still 10% left, no reason here to buy from the grid? So instead use the capacity below the DESS min. SoC as an buffer, so system don't buy from grid, and then recalculate a new target if necessary.

I'd imagine "minimum soc unless grid fails" could be 0% as it use to be here, grid is really stable here in Denmark. And DESS Minimum SoC could be 20% or what ever, so DESS can do it's thing until 20% then use some of the remaining capacity below 20% as a buffer so it won't buy from grid to keep the target SoC, this just happend in peak morning hours.

I know it's complicated.

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stoyanov9 commented · Mar 21 at 08:12 AM

Hi everyone,

First of all congrats on the amazing functionality!

What time zone should I use to insert the hourly rates (fixed or variable)?

For instance I am located in Bulgaria (EET) and my local night rate is between 22:00-06:00 local time. Do I have to set this rate between 21:00-05:00 (CET)?

The selling rates are variable and are with delivery time set in CET.

Thank you

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ stoyanov9 commented · Mar 22 at 10:58 AM

If everything works as intended you should enter it in your local time. But as dealing with different timezones and getting everything working right is a known can of worms, I can't rule out that we overlooked things there.

If it does not work as you expect, please do tag me.

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stoyanov9 Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 22 at 12:23 PM

Hi Dirk,

Thanks for coming back. Indeed time zones are kind of tricky and I have the following concern related this time to the selling prices timing and application to the volumes produced in time zones other than CET.

I have set the selling price formula to (p - p*0.08 - 0.009) and I guess p is derived from the official market segment "Day Ahead" with delivery time defined per CET zone.

The above chart is converted very nicely into the below pricing breakdown per hour in VRM, which exactly matches the spike in selling price at 19:00 CET for instance.

My concern is that my system is located in time zone EET (CET + 1) and the price above (for the hour 19:00-20:00 CET) would be applied to the quantities produced (discharged from the battery) in the hour 20:00-21:00 EET.

This has an impact on planning battery charge/discharge times especially around lunch time when often selling prices are very low just for an hour or two. For instance the DESS charged my battery at most between 12:00-13:00 based on the above CET hourly selling prices as this is when the selling price was lowest. However, the quantities of my system that will be priced at the lowest price will be the quantities produced between 13:00-14:00 EET. As a result, it would have been better if the battery was charged between 13:00-14:00 EET local time.

Hope the above is clear. If you need more details please let me know

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ stoyanov9 commented · Mar 25 at 01:33 PM

While I do see that the system did sell some of the energy too cheaply, it does seem to stick to the correct hour, agreed? This is also quite clear from tomorrows plan:

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stoyanov9 Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 26 at 02:23 AM

Hi Dirk,

The two charts seem well aligned, suggesting it's ideal to charge the battery during the hour with the lowest selling price if both charts used the same time zone (CET). However, it seems the first chart uses CET, while the second chart uses local time (EET, which is CET+1). This means the quantities produced locally at 14:00-15:00 will actually have the lowest price. Therefore, it would be best to charge the battery at 14:00-15:00 rather than 13:00-14:00.

Below I quote communication from my trader.

Question: Could you please give me more information about what "delivery time: CET" means on ibex.bg?
If the announced price for the hour 09:00-10:00 is for example euro 70/MW/h, does it apply to the quantities produced during the time range 10:00-11:00 (local time EET)?

Answer: Yes, the exchange announces prices according to Central European Time (CET) because it is tied to other European exchanges, but our country operates according to Eastern European Time (EET). If a price of 70 eur/MWh is announced for 09:00-10:00, then it is applied to the quantities produced during the time range 10:00-11:00 our time.

Regards,

Pavel

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markess commented · Mar 21 at 10:01 AM

It was mentioned before that once Dynamic ESS was rolled out the VRM grid data would include 'Grid from Battery' data, but I still see only Grid to Battery data e.g.

I assume one does not have to have Dynamic ESS enabled first. Will a "From Battery" box be added to above?

Many thanks.

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Martin Holy commented · Mar 21 at 10:37 AM

Hi,

would it be possible to see the dashboards of the DESS after configuration without having the DESS enabled e.g.: via a toggle button? The KPIs are quite useful for other custom implementations as well.

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Andi commented · Mar 21 at 04:27 PM

Hi!

Why does the system sell electricity when it is deactivated?

ID c0619ab313dc

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Andi commented · Mar 22 at 08:46 AM

I am a bit confused. Dynamic ESS was disabled during that time on your site. Disabling dynamic ESS includes disabling the rules and restrictions that are part of Dynamic ESS. Which seems logical to me.

We'd need to put the ruleset in a higher level then Dynamic ESS to make the rules and restrictions apply for the whole site, unrelated to Dynamic ESS / ESS or other systems to accomplish this. That is not how the system currently works. Changing that would have a huge impact on the other parts of the system too.

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Andi Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 24 at 12:36 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)
I am a bit confused. Dynamic ESS was disabled during that time on your site. Disabling dynamic ESS includes disabling the rules and restrictions that are part of Dynamic ESS. Which seems logical to me.

Sometimes (like today) I disable DESS to load the cheapest prices at Tibber and to fully charge my battery. Today 17 cent.

We'd need to put the ruleset in a higher level then Dynamic ESS to make the rules and restrictions apply for the whole site, unrelated to Dynamic ESS / ESS or other systems to accomplish this. That is not how the system currently works. Changing that would have a huge impact on the other parts of the system too.

I don't understand that. Can you please explain to me exactly what you mean?

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grua commented · Mar 21 at 09:42 PM

Does it still make sense to always install the latest Venus OS beta version, as was the case in the DESS beta phase? That would currently be v3.40~1, for example.

Or now that DESS has been officially released, stick with the official Venus OS versions?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ grua commented · Mar 22 at 08:15 AM

It does not matter too much. The beta releases might add get extra functionality a bit early before it ends up on the regular one. But it also adds the risk of us breaking some existing functionality.

If you just want to run it and don't care about getting new functionality a bit earlier, stick to the official release.

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hornbyben commented · Mar 22 at 06:34 AM

It’s great to see DESS live. With your comment on 30 min pricing being in the works, will that also include a link to the Octopus API, as that provider is the most common variable pricing energy provider in the UK, and it would be great to be included.

Currently I’m doing the setup manually every day when I get the day ahead prices.

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simon-jukes commented · Mar 22 at 01:56 PM

I understand the system is leaning, but Is it normal during the fist 28 days for DESS to charge the battery during the day when rate is high, and hardly put any charge in battery over night on cheap rate. Rates are setup in settings. For example, currently generating solar with forecast for sun to continue this afternoon, SOC is already at 76% but the system is currently charging from grid at 1600w on peak rate electricty.?

Simon

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kositch commented · Mar 22 at 02:01 PM

Hi,

I have boiler connected to AC2 Out which is switched on based on SoC, it is configured inside the Multiplus and uses its SSR, it turns on phase 1 at 95%, phase 2 at 97% etc., is it possible to make DESS working with that? When I switched DESS on, battery does not reach above 90%, it starts feeding the grid when SoC is 80%. I suppose it can't work together (boiler control and DESS active) or can I somehow tell the system to charge the battery above 90% when there is enough PV power?

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kositch commented · Mar 22 at 02:40 PM

When there will be some news about DESS functioning, where is the best place to subscribe to be informed? And second question - when there are some improvements, is it needed to update Cerbo GX to make them active or does this happen on some Victron cloud and those changes are effective when released?

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sarowe commented · Mar 23 at 03:30 PM

Wir hatten das Thema schon einmal bei der Beta Version. Ich habe heute mal wieder beobachtet das das DESS beim parallelen Laden aus dem Netz und PV Produktion, die PV Produktion runtergeregelt wurde.

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ahtih commented · Mar 23 at 04:14 PM

Forecast is not quite reasonable.

Very high consumption forecasted for tommorrow. I had high consumption 3 weeks ago but not that high as forecasted and last two Sundays it has been less.

Last 30 days

Forecast for Sunday

And solar irradiation forecast for tomorrow is about 2 times less than for today but DESS thinks that solar production will still be higher. 6,4 for tomorrow and 4,8 for today. Maybe it will be, we well see tomorrow but it does not seem to add up with irradiation forecast.

Have to disable DESS tomorrow because there is nowhere to put solar if target SOC will be 100% for most of the day and not much real consumption.

Site id 48e7da86cd8b

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jimg commented · Mar 24 at 07:52 AM

Any plans to add the UK to the list of supported countries and it's suppliers who now have a wide selection of smart tariffs.

Some smart tariffs have up to 3 different pricing periods for both import and export, some have variable half hour pricing during a 24 hour period.

Feedback on the solar forecast element of DESS - I've been observing the daily forecasts for several months while DESS has been in Beta. For our location - Chester, NW of England, the forecasting is often miles out and nowhere near reality.

Also now in the UK, some energy providers are offering smart tariffs where the energy provider controls the charging and discharging of our batteries to automatically charge the batteries during periods of low grid pricing during the day and discharge during the peak 4-7pm period.

Example Octopus Energy - Intelligent Flux tariff, currently in beta with Givenergy batteries.

Any plans to offer similar integration?

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Peter jimg commented · Mar 24 at 08:11 AM

We in GbbOptimizer support such tariffs and 30-minutes timeslots.

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morkfromork commented · Mar 25 at 07:23 AM

Hi all, I've configured Dynamic Ess, reloaded the config with the new assistent in my Multiplus. But now the Multiplus does not sell to the grid or provide power for self consumption. Charging goes well. Do you know what I did wrong?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ morkfromork commented · Mar 25 at 03:18 PM

It looks like there is something strange with your grid meter, as your site is not recording the energy for today and yesterday.
Without that data, the system is unable to create a reasonable schedule.

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ojack Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 25 at 05:12 PM

It looks like

a) energy meter is wired upside down

b) there is a PV Inverter at L1 which is not measured by the GX device

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kudos50 commented · Mar 25 at 07:37 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Last Saturday afternoon during a DESS planned "buy" event the MPPT charger was throttled back to zero for about 5mins. Battery was almost full but charge current from multi's was still very high. In fact, it started charging again before the pylons reached 100%.

I you have a moment, 23rd of march 15:00 - 15:10.

# c0619ab2ef52

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kudos50 kudos50 commented · Mar 28 at 07:46 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) on top of that, remember that you noticed my system regularly needs to work without forecast and falls back to strategy 1 ? I have a feeling this is getting worse and I'm only not seeing it because it's operating on low-soc most of the time.

Can you help me understand and fix this ? I have been using DESS for very long time so history for forecast should not be a problem ?

I have my VRM statistics set to 1 minute interval. Can it be something simple like that perhaps ?

For now, I run a flow to re-set strategy to 0 for an hour if 1 on schedule0 and 1 on schedule1 is detected.

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kudos50 kudos50 commented · Apr 08 at 07:57 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) , @Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) I have noticed it several times now. Every time DESS plans a 100 charge, the MPPT RS throttles back to 0W for about 5 mins when soc is at ~97%. Could be that is the point at which bulk charge ends.

The Multi's are still continuing the charge process for a few mins with 1000W+ so the 5mins is basically a waste of mppt rs solar energy.

100% is reached way later due to balancing and the MPPT RS is back at it's full power point way before that.

I can imagine this not being related specially to DESS. Maybe even just to the MPPT RS and the interval between full scans after having throttled back ? Please assist or point me in the right direction.

Last recorded even was yesterday (7th of April) at 14:40 / c0619ab2ef52

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kositch commented · Mar 25 at 01:37 PM

Can @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) please explain me, why DESS behaves like this on my setup? I attach screenshots of settings - during the highest energy price it covers the consumption of home from grid and not from battery.

When I look on tomorrows plan, it seems it just wants to use battery for covering morning consumption, when the price is high and then it does not want to use battery at all.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ kositch commented · Mar 25 at 03:53 PM

It looks like the cause is that the consumption forecast is quite bad for your site, which negatively influences the planning.

The only thing I can do about that right now is to make sure that your site gets to be one of the first that gets the improved forecasting early.

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kositch Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 25 at 05:24 PM

Perfect, thank you, do I need to update Cerbo for that improvement or do you need my ID?

Second question - is it possible to set somehow to prioritize battery charging above 97% so my boiler can turn on when exceeding that threshold, which was set by PV system provider using Multiplus AC2-Out?

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kositch Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 29 at 05:27 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Not sure if new forecast consumption model is already in place, but yesterday was forecast good, so I have switched DESS again on, but when big consumption during night tonight did not happened (we were not charging our EV tonight) the model for a whole day got recalculated so there is predicted no consumption for a day at all so the schedule is just to sell energy, which is of course totally incorrect, so I had to disable DESS again:-( I don't know why when the expected consumption does not happen it changes forecast for a whole day. My ID: c0619ab1e051

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stefan-db commented · Mar 25 at 03:26 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

I see that the target SOC @24h is changed from Min SOC to higher value. Looks like it is calculation off planned consumption till next production is high enough. What is the correct way. Only the multiplication x1.25 (transformation losses DC->AC) is not made.

I would even make this correction higher factor 1.5 or even 2 to cover also unplanned extra consumption. Do you look also to next day (production - consumption) > 0 ? Because if there is not enough sun next day you need to keep more in the battery.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ stefan-db commented · Mar 25 at 03:40 PM

Reaching that extra end of day SOC is currently only active in the Node-RED implementation. At the moment that is the only way to set the extra amount of battery charging to accommodate for the use between midnight and sunrise.

The fact that you see the plan for the extra charging comes from the fact that tomorrows prices are in and the underlying algorithm now plans to the end of tomorrow. But given the time of day, it leaves only little time to charge from solar.

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stefan-db Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 25 at 05:29 PM

ok but till yesterday it was Min Soc now it is 20% what is aprox equal to the needs till sunsire without the mentioned corrections. I tought finnaly :) . Battery was at the moment off checking 100% charged he adjusted only the export a bit.

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ojack Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 25 at 06:11 PM

Wouldn't it be an option to prohibit sales from the morning until the prices for the following day are published and then decide whether to sell or continue charging the battery? If you realize at midday that it would have been better to charge the battery all day, it is unfortunately too late ;-)

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shaunuk commented · Mar 26 at 06:53 AM

We have a 10x cost difference between off peak and on peak, 4.5p at night 12-5am and then 5-23:59 - 44p. So we very much avoid all peak usage. I have have had dynamic ESS on for a few days with sensible values and today I have woke up to a 14% charged battery over night. Dynamic ess is buying and selling in the off peak period back and fourth and I have no idea why.

Any ideas before I need to switch it off ?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ shaunuk commented · Mar 26 at 10:21 AM

Not sure yet, but you are right that it should not have used the battery for consumption. We'll look into this.

Meanwhile, what you can do is to set the battery cycle cost a bit higher, so that it is higher than the low grid price (e.g. set it to £ 0.05). Then the system should favor using the grid for consumption during those low price periods.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ shaunuk commented · Mar 26 at 12:16 PM

I am also quite sure that the max import power of 100 kW is wrong. It typically does not exceed 20 kW, of course depending on the type of grid connection you have.
As the system does calculate with that capability, having it set wrongly will negatively affect the calculations and scheduling.

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ojack Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 26 at 12:42 PM

In Germany for example many grid connections for normal houses have 63A at 3 phases. So 63A x 400V x sqrt(3) = 44kW

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Simon Hackett commented · Mar 26 at 06:55 AM

I have a question about the currency selection in the code and in VRM in general.

In the VRM general settings, there is an option for US Dollars but not for Australian dollars. Can Australian dollars be added?

On an (obviously) related note - if I change the currency unit in VRM generally, does the Dynamic ESS menu currency setup inherit that change automatically?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Simon Hackett commented · Mar 26 at 10:38 AM

Yes, we'll add Australian dollars.

And yes, Dynamic ESS inherits the sites currency automatically.

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waldfee commented · Mar 26 at 10:06 AM

Is it normal that DESS ignores the minimum SOC and optimized without battery life?

My minimal SOC is 10% and battery life is off, but the system stops sometimes at SOC 30 or 50 and i use grid instead battery. It seems that battery life is working although it is off. I want to use my minimum SOC 10%, because when my PV wont load my batterie the DESS should load from the grid when the price is low. But at the moment i start with over 40% battery in the day and my PV charges the battery now immediately to full. The rest of the day i sell my PV to grid and in the night i buy from the grid while my battery is over SOC30.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ waldfee commented · Mar 26 at 10:53 AM

It will usually plan for anything between min SOC and 100%. There is no guarantee that either of those will be matched (at least not until we have the periodic charging to 100% life).

At the moment it seems you have DESS switched off (since early this morning) on your site. When you had it on on the 23th, it went as low as 14%. And the highest was 92%.

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waldfee Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 26 at 12:09 PM

Yes i switched it this morning off at 6 in the morning. After i woke up i saw that since yesterday after 10 in the night the SOC stopped at 34% and i consumed from the grid. This stays until the morning and i turned DESS off to use my battery.

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grua waldfee commented · Mar 26 at 11:19 AM

I think DESS just followed it's target SOC as it should. You read the DESS-manual and know the principles of DESS, espacially the strategy of following the target SOC each hour?

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waldfee grua commented · Mar 26 at 12:15 PM

Not really. I undertstood it like the SOC will be loaded to the maximum the DESS calculates to fullfill your daily consumption.

But this includes to use the whole SOC the system gives you. Also when Tibber is activated, then should it load in cheap times.

I thought it will not keep some SOC in reserve. When ia have now battery still over min SOC and my house takes it from the grid than why use DESS? This is the behavior of battery life on. Thats why i turned battery life off.

My opinion was that DESS will load to maximum need SOC when the price is cheap and maximum SOC will be calculated by DESS and will not be fix 100.

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daniel-feist commented · Mar 26 at 04:50 PM

How can this be explained:

- Hardly charged overnight at all on cheap rate.
- At 6am was already importing from the grid (4 times the price).
- Sent almost all excess PV (18kWh) during the day to the grid.
- Exported battery -> grid 1-3pm (when not enough SoC for evening)
- Importing from grid again at 4pm.
- No where near enough in battery for evening usage. Grid usage planned all evening.

Weird thing is that yesterday it seemed to work really well. Today this logic makes no sense at all though.

c0619ab38079 (26/03/24)

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daniel-feist daniel-feist commented · Mar 26 at 05:37 PM

And tommorow:

- Plans to charge minumum possible from gird (even when import is cheaper than export!!)
- Assumes all evening usage will be covered by PV (which may not happen, depending on cloud).

What should happen:

- Charge overnight for all forcast usage (or more, given it can be exported for profit)
- Export all PV straight to grid (no effieincy losses)
- Any excess in battery in evening can be exported for (small) profit to grid.
- Solar->Battery should happen before Solar->Grid (if required), in case PV doesn't happen.

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avukat38 daniel-feist commented · Mar 27 at 07:07 AM

hello everyone

I think it works properly for me, DESS, I am a fixed price subscriber, I have permission to sell it to the 10KWH grid, I have a 480A battery, I have a 20KWH solar panel, my program is PV first to start the loads and then sell it to the grid for 10kWh, after 10kWh passes, it charges my batteries, it works perfectly on sunny days, in the morning Grid feeding starts with the first light of the sun, when the production exceeds 10 kWh, my batteries start charging, charging is completed when the target SOC reaches 99%, if the production is not enough for consumption, it uses my batteries, not the grid. This way, I can make the most sales without using the network at all.

The problem is only on cloudy days. If the PV production does not exceed 10kwh, my batteries do not charge.

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daniel-feist daniel-feist commented · Mar 28 at 08:27 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Is this behaviour expected currently, or some issue with my system?

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rikhf commented · Mar 27 at 07:13 AM

Can't get into VRM settings page. When I go to Settings -> Dynamic ESS both buttons "toggle on/off" and "start configuration" are greyed out.

The system: 6 x MPII 5kVA, 3 fase, FW 508, assistant 018C. Venus OS 3.40~1.

Did I miss something?

ID: c0619ab33ea2.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ rikhf commented · Mar 27 at 10:21 AM

That was an error in a filter on our side. We've cleaned that filter and now it should be working again. Thanks for reporting.

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rikhf Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Mar 27 at 09:42 PM

Indeed it is working now. Tnx Dirk Jan!

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rikhf rikhf commented · Mar 28 at 07:25 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Well, it still doesn't go as smoothly as one should wish. Now I fill in the figures, no selling to the grid on this location but still get this warning. Is this a bug?

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rikhf rikhf commented · Mar 28 at 10:49 AM

Fixed it by working around. Saved the settings as if I could sell to grid and afterwards editted the settings and put sell to grid on No. That does the trick. Bug?

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axel-koning rikhf commented · Apr 01 at 01:23 PM

Is in VRM - general setting - realtime set on ?

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guntherb commented · Mar 27 at 07:21 AM

Id: c0619ab42937

I am very pleased with the DESS. However, yesterday (26/03) I saw on the Energy graph that the system loads the battery from the grid for small amounts of time/KWh although there is enough solar (see the red circles on the graph). Is there an explanation for this behaviour? Thanks.

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alex-itcus guntherb commented · Mar 28 at 05:55 PM

When the panels are dropping fast the generated power or a consumer starts the system has a moment of des-equilibrium that is stopped with the help of the grid. This creates short sales and buys. Adjust the grid offset at +50W or test a value that works for the power and consumers in your system.

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indisa commented · Mar 28 at 12:16 AM

I'm from Spain and my energy provider is Octopus. When I try to select energy providers, none appear, although I would be fine with using the indexed price.

This is the formula I use for the electricity calculation:

(p+0.005)×1.235

Energy provider profit share = 0.005 VAT + Taxes = 1.236 (21% VAT, 2.5% tax)

This is the formula my provider includes in the contract:

Energy (€) = ([Σ(p=1 to n) (OMIEp+CMp+RCp) * (1+PRedp)] + 0.005) * M + ATRe) * Consumed Energy p

The simplified formula would be: indexed price + 0.005

In Dynamic Energy System (Dymamic ess), it always shows that the price is less than 0.01€.

s shows that the price is less than 0.01€.

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Andi commented · Mar 28 at 05:15 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)
ID c0619ab313dc
DESS activatet,
Bad Weather,
Akku65% (2x280AH),
2 hrs cheapest Tibber price (17 cent),
no battery charging from the grid,

Maybe I'm misunderstanding DESS, but I always thought that charging from the grid is also part of this logic.

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grua Andi commented · Mar 28 at 05:38 AM

You should also show the SOC progression planned by DESS. DESS is currently still planning for SOC to be at min. SOC at the end of the day. With your 65%, this will probably work out even without charging the battery. In this case, DESS tries not to "waste" money and prefers to sell PV surplus.

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kositch grua commented · Mar 28 at 07:09 AM

Also depends on battery price/kWh you have set, it too high, it can omit charging from grid some times.... In future updates, they should preffer charging batteries much higher than it behaves now. Lets wait...

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Andi grua commented · Mar 28 at 11:00 AM

Where can I find the "SOC development"?

I have disabled "selling PV surplus".

The battery price/kWh is set at 0.03 cents/kWh.

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grua Andi commented · Mar 28 at 12:07 PM

I mean this blue line here:

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Andi grua commented · Mar 28 at 03:50 PM

I had DESS disabled for charging this afternoon.

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steve0564 commented · Mar 28 at 10:56 AM

I tried DESS again. Unfortunately, I discovered that since one of the last DESS versions was feeding into the grid very often, even though I had prohibited feeding into the grid with 0W and in the settings.
Unfortunately, the grid-feed-function is deactivated in that moment, when activating DESS. Unfortunately, this cannot be used for me in Germany.

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sarowe steve0564 commented · Mar 28 at 11:20 AM

Bei meiner als Nulleinspeisung konfigurierten Anlage ist das nicht der Fall. Es wird ab und an etwas ins Netz gedrückt aber nicht andes als beim normalen ESS. Ich habe mich vor einiger Zeit kundig gemacht und habe als Antwort bekommen, das diese Kleinstmengen als nicht vermeidbare Regelverluste gelten. Von dem im Gesetz genannten Greenwashing kann in dem Fall nicht die Rede sein. Diese Regelverluste beruhen auch zum großen Teil auf der maximalen Regelgeschwindigkeit von 400W/s.

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steve0564 sarowe commented · Mar 28 at 11:48 AM

@Sarowe: ohne DESS mit aktivierter Netzeinspeisung auf 0W lief es in Verbindung mit einem separaten BKW (600Wp) besser. Es wurde auf den Gridsetpoint genauer ausreguliert, indem dann direkt vom Grid in die Batterie geladen wurde, solange bis der Gridsetpoint wieder einigermaßen passte. Jetzt mit aktiviertem DESS und dadurch deaktivierter Netzeinspeisungfunktion klappt das nicht mehr. Da wird schonmal minutenlang mit -200W (Anzeige) ins Netz geschoben (je nach Sonnenschein).
Ich weiß schon, dass solche Kleinstmengen für den Grundversorger irrelevant sind, trotzdem lief es, wie oben beschrieben, schonmal viel besser. ich hoffe Dirk-Jan liest hier mit....

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grua steve0564 commented · Mar 28 at 12:04 PM

Habe nicht alle deine bisherigen Kommentare zuvor gelesen, aber du schreibst vom Grid Setpoint. Hast du den auf einen Wert <> 0W parametriert?

Bei aktivierten DESS wird immer grid setpoint = 0W angenommen, etwaiger anderer parametrierter Wert wird im DESS derzeit noch ignoriert und nur im normalen ESS verwendet.

Habe ich bei Dirk-Jan aber bereits eingelastet.

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sarowe grua commented · Mar 28 at 12:41 PM

Ich habe zwar kein separates BKW, aber ich kann deine Beobachtungen nicht teilen. Beim normalen ESS habe ich am Netzpoint etwas gespielt. Im Sommer mehr Richtung Einspeisung, im Winter ehr Richtung Bezug, das ist nicht mehr möglich, richtig. Aber davon zu sprechen, das DESS in D deshalb nicht einsetzbar ist, halte ich für völlig überzogen. Ausserdem ist die kleine Einspeisung nicht ein Problem für den VNB es ist einfach nach EEG verboten und würde als Subventionensbetrug gewertet. Damit dann ein Problem mit dem Zoll und nicht dem VNB. Der freut sich über geschenkte Energie.

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hans818 commented · Mar 28 at 12:52 PM

The Grid feed in Maximum in the ESS setting do not seems to work for AC pv inverters on AC out, max is now 300 W still pushing to the grid (at very low price ?)

gr Hans

VRM id : c0619ab4d86f

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hans818 hans818 commented · Apr 10 at 12:57 PM

stange behavior , loading from the grid to battery , while the forecast for solar not fit in the battery today.

gr Hans

VRM id : c0619ab4d86f

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fdues commented · Mar 31 at 09:50 AM

Hi, my system does not Charge when Dynamic ess is on.

Vrm ID:c0619ab4bbc2

This happens very often and I don’t know why.

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Björn Kellermann commented · Apr 01 at 09:30 PM

DESS schedule does not obey "grit current limit"

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

Cerbo GX v3.30, MP2-5000

VRM portal ID: c0619ab4b370

I have a MP2 and DESS running.

Grid current limiting set to 3A, which is obeyed. Max charge/discharge is around 600-700W.

DESS is working as well. On low price grid is used to charge battery. On high price battery is used primarily. Thanks for the great work!

Maybe I found a small flaw. The DESS schedule seems to show higher scheduled values for „Grid to Battery“ (2,5kWh) compared to what is possible in respect to the grid current limit set to 3A -> 0,7kWh.

I assume the capability of the MP2-5000 is used for scheduling and not the grid current limit set.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Björn Kellermann commented · Apr 02 at 06:52 AM

For the calculations of the schedule the capabilities, set in the dynamic ESS settings, are being used. I see that you have set these to:

Maximum discharge power	2.4 kW
Maximum charge power	2.4 kW

If you set those to 0.7 kW, the schedule should start matching the limits.

I agree that it is a bit double to set the limit on 2 places, so I'll check if we can start calculating with the lowest of the two set values.

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Björn Kellermann Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 02 at 09:19 AM

To get even more accurate schedules, there might be more parameters:

capability of connected MP2s/Quattros…
battery load/discharge
grid current limit
AC solar forecast
MPPT/DC connected and MPPT solar forecast as they do not influence grid current limit
AC feed access
MPPT/DC feed access

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Jeroen Peters Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 02 at 09:36 PM

Would be very helpful to take the DESS limits as hard limits on the charging and discharging when the grid is connected and there is no case of peak shaving. Now I see more than 4kWh of discharge in some hours while the DESS limit is only 3kW.

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Andi Björn Kellermann commented · Apr 05 at 04:31 AM

Hallo Björn.
Bei mir funktioniert das leider nicht. Ich habe Tage da kostet der Strom 17 cent, aber DESS läd meinen Akku nicht.
Könntest du mal einen screenshot von deinen DESS Einstellungen machen, das ich mal vergleichen kann?

Gruß Andi

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lennart-1 commented · Apr 02 at 09:06 AM

Today I noticed that the forecasted consumption went haywire, this wasn't the case in previous days with dynamic ESS enabled. This also don't represent other historic consumption (see previous days). I don't charge an electric car or have other giant loads that consume 5kw/6kw.

The DESS planning is struggling to plan to buy energy today at the low prices because of the high forecasted consumption en already started buying energie hours before the lowest point. An hour ago I disabled DESS and will enable DESS at 12:00 to take-in grid power to the battery at the lowest price.

You would think that at some point DESS would realize that the forecast consumption is way-off and would recalculate this.

System ID: c0619ab24334

Other info for today

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lennart-1 lennart-1 commented · Apr 02 at 09:46 AM

Forecast consumption has changed changed and after that I re-anabled DESS.
Still don't now what caused the consumption forecast to go that high.
How often does DESS recalculate the forecasts and planning?

After forecast recalculation, with DESS still temporary disabled:

After forecast recalculation and enabling DESS,
The scheduled charging from the grid is now at the cheapest time:

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kositch commented · Apr 02 at 11:54 AM

Any explanation, why the DESS is feeding consumption from grid to when batteries are charged and there are peak price hours now, it does not make sense.

Portal ID: c0619ab1e051

UPDATE: After a one hour, consumption forecast somehow changed to 0 consumption (compare it with forecast from screenshot above where the forecast was correct) and SoC is scheduled to hold to 100%, not sure what is happening, but it is quite strange resulting to permanent grid usage and those consumption forecast "drop-offs" are very often completely disturbing almost perfectly planned DESS schedule...

Update 2: Because of that I disabled DESS, after a two hours, consumption prediction completely changed to extremely high for a change, see next screenshot. Hope this helps for better troubleshooting. It seems, that when I enable DESS, consumption forecast goes down to almost no predicted consumption, when I disable DESS, it reverts back to high consumption forecast.

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mheinze5722 commented · Apr 02 at 07:59 PM

Ok, I started playing around with dynamic ESS. I will watch the algo and its results for a couple days, but before I comment on this, a couple other notes:

- In the pricing configuration, you should state that the price should include any transfer fees, charges, taxes etc. Essentially the full amount one has to pay. For example, in Austria, with Awattar, yes, the formula is correct [price *1,03+0,015)*1,2], but it should actually include the "Nebenkosten" of around 8 to 9 cents as well. I did that by changing the increment to 0,095 and thus reflecting this additional cost element.

- the battery has not only cost in terms of usage of lifecycles, but also in terms of rount-trip losses of 10 to 20%. This should be part of the algorithm and ideally the settings. essentially this makes the battery more expensive, and should lead to less "trading".

- You guys should state the principals of the algorithm, and perhaps (on a schematic level) disclose the computation process. this itself will clear out many concerns and questions. Also, I believe Victron would philosophically make the Dynamic ESS an option that virtually every user should have turned on (and perhaps become and industry expectation?). Building trust is crucial to this point.

- The graphic at the bottom is great:

I would just try to add the cost element against another y axis in a different color, and also include the SOC line in there. With this one graph, you essentially combine three other graphs on this VRM landing page! And, once the prices are available for the next day (from 2 pm on) I would immediatly show today and tomorrow (48 hrs). Then everybody can see everything happening in one glance. Very powerful! :-)

These are my comments before I go into the algorithm in a couple days/weeks once I glean more insights there after watching (but not yet activating it).

Final note from your post: High volume consumers (Heat pump and EV charging) are indeed crucial. For example, in our household we are EV charging 98% of the year surplus PV only... so any form of Victron Wallbox surplus energy charging should be excluded from the consumption numbers (or an option to include/exclude all or surplus only)... otherwise it distorts the consumption numbers which otherwise look ok'ish. :-)

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Martin mheinze5722 commented · Apr 11 at 03:42 PM

I agree with the suggestions you made. In the Netherlands, however, price configuration is somewhat simpler due to the government's netting scheme. As a result, almost all energy suppliers have the same price per hour for purchasing and selling. I expect that will be change in the future.

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anonimoes commented · Apr 03 at 07:22 AM

So I enabled DESS two days ago, this morning first the battery is discharging into the grid because of high prices which is very good and understandable (between 8 en 9 am). But then the system starts charging the battery from the grid, still at a high price. This seems very counter intuitive to me, especially since the system plans to discharge again the next hour.

Can someone explain this behaviour?

These are the relevant screenshots from VRM:

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axel-koning commented · Apr 03 at 11:57 AM

Hi there,

DESS should be charging this hour to target soc, but does not. It seems that it expects PV to charge, but there is only a cloud in the way.....The solar expectations are way to high for days and DESS is not charging to the target soc. In the next hours DESS will charge I think, but will never reach the total charge of the battery in the cheap hours anymore.

After 2 hours charging the third hour was again not charging (even discharging a little).

Had this behavior in the last days, and sometimes it even discharges below minimum soc also....

VRM -id: c0619ab4b607

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axel-koning axel-koning commented · Apr 05 at 01:52 PM

Hi Victron, I am very glad with all your work ! But ther are negative prices now and soc target dess os 61% this hour also last hour ~40%. But Dess is discharge below min soc my battery.

I had to put DESS off and soc to 100% to get manually charge the battery now.

What is happening here ? Can you help me out ?

vrm -id c0619ab4b607

With regards

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nietschy axel-koning commented · Apr 09 at 12:59 PM

that looks to be the same as my problem.

"good to know" that I am not alone here

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anonimoes commented · Apr 05 at 05:05 PM

I have another issue to report: the grid limit is not being respected as it should be. Today the battery has been charging at it's max speed and I am also charging our cars because of the low prices at the moment.

I have a 3 phase grid connection with 25A per phase, a Victron multi 5000VA on Phase 1 with the battery, an Opel Corsa that can charge on 1 phase only and a Skoda Enyaq that can do 3 phase charging.

I initially set my max import power at 15,75kW, figuring that this would be divided by the 3 phases. When I start a 1 phase charge with the car, phase 1 quickly exceeds 25A limit and because my car charger (a Myenergy Zappi) is also load balancing then stays at 25A. The same happens with a 3 phase charge, none of this time the total limit of the 3 phases as a whole is exceeded of course. But even when I set the max import power to 7kW or even 4kW the multiplus keeps charging and the import power exceeds the set limit by a very wide margin!

I would think that setting an amperage limit per phase would make much more sense, or at least to divide the import limit by 3 and reduce charging if the limit/3 is reached on one of the phases. But even if the limit is exceeded the multi keeps charging...

Dirk-Jan: do you know what is happening here?

My site ID is: c0619ab343b0

Screenshot with 1 phase car charging:

Screenshot with 3 phase car charging:

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ anonimoes commented · Apr 09 at 01:06 PM

Have you seen https://www.victronenergy.com/live/drafts:dynamic_ess#qwhy_does_the_system_exceed_the_configured_power ?

I see that your system has a grid meter, so you should be able to set the import and export AC current limits via the Settings → ESS menu in the GX.

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anonimoes Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 09 at 03:02 PM

Thanks for your reply! I cannot find these settings in my remote console under ESS. My cerbo is on v3.30, build date 20240319094732. When I check for updates it says there are no updates. Is the v3.30~10 still in Beta maybe?

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kudos50 anonimoes commented · Apr 09 at 03:35 PM

I'm on the same version:

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anonimoes kudos50 commented · Apr 09 at 07:01 PM

Wow! Thanks a lot! I did not think the option would be under Peak shaving...

Edit: I've set the values now! @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) : It might be a good idea to change the screenshot of this functionality in the manual, right now it says ESS on the top of the image from the remote console, that's why I thought it should be directly under ESS settings and not under Peak Shaving. Or at least state that this function can be enabled by setting peak shaving to 'always'.

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Rasmus Mikkelsen commented · Apr 08 at 06:17 AM

Hi.

I was wondering is there any reason why I can't see the grid limit setting anywhere? I use an EM24 meter over ethernet. Latest assistent and firmwares.

Vrm id: 48e7da87e9ab

I also wonder why "battery SoC unless grid fails" is a function of DESS? I can be wrong, but it discharges down to this value right, currently set to 20%.

But as soon as I hit this limit / SoC value (with is tonight at 23 according to plan) it starts pulling from the grid instead... Which is kinda weird, isn't it? That means I'm on grid from midnight to solar starts producing tomorrow. Even though I still have 20% SoC left on batteries?

Shouldn't there be another setting for DESS, where It can play with SoC down to like 20% and rest is kept for self consumption throughout the night, until surplus solar again?

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nietschy commented · Apr 09 at 11:19 AM

Dear friends of energy.

my VRM ID c0847dba52b1

I have just updated all FW and enabled DESS.

This is my system:

system overview

My Problem is, that it does not really charge the battery even if there is a lot of surplus PV energy.

I think I know why: it does not show any forecasted consumption, and it assumes that it does not need the batteries and should export everything.

See my forecast part:

it tells that there is some forecasted total, but it not shown in the graph and I think its not used at all because of that.

I read some posts here, but I just wanted to put my observations in, maybe it helps to solve the issues.

I set up my battery costs to a minimum, but I do not think that this makes a difference if the system assumes no consumption costs at all...

If I can help with supplying more data or info, I am glad to help.

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grua nietschy commented · Apr 09 at 11:59 AM

I think you have to acticate "show forecast" here:

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nietschy grua commented · Apr 09 at 12:33 PM

you are right, it shows in the graph when I activate this button (that I didn't knew it existed) ^^

I changed it, but sadly it still does not work.

but if we look further down we still do not see any predicted grid costs:

If I disable DESS it works just fine.

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oskar commented · Apr 09 at 12:18 PM

Would like a feature to configure what the target SOC shall be before sun goes down.
I would like to have the Battery 100% full by Solar after each day on "summer days".
My grid cost is very much higher than electricity cost/earning.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ oskar commented · Apr 09 at 01:01 PM

There is a bit of a delay on getting this into the VRM implementation. For now you can do that only by using the Node-RED implementation (https://github.com/victronenergy/dynamic-ess).

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ojack Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 09 at 01:11 PM

I tried this node red implementation a few days ago and it works good. Charging was priorized and selling startet after reaching target.

But could not try it under a condition with too less solar for reaching the target.

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daniel-feist Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 10 at 02:45 PM

I would test Node-RED version, but seems only for dynamic pricing and I can't be configured with fixed pricing. Is this correct?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ daniel-feist commented · Apr 17 at 11:38 AM

This is largely correct. You can dynamically set the buy and sell price formula by scheduled injecting either `msg.buy_price_formula` or `msg.sell_price_formula` into the Dynamic ESS node. This is definitely not optimal (as all calculations then go via that new price), but it should work ok-ish.

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kositch commented · Apr 09 at 02:28 PM

Does DESS respects "min SoC unless grid fails" value? Meaning when I set in VRM this value for example to 20% so it will not discharge the battery under this value under any conditions unless grid fails.

And second question - when I change this value to higher then current SoC, for example current SoC will be 45 and I will change it to 55% will it start charging the battery from grid or will it stay on 45% (in condition there is no PV power).

Thanks!

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anonimoes kositch commented · Apr 09 at 02:53 PM

In my experience this is the case (both of your questions). Last weekend I inadvertently set my minimum SOC to 85% and was wondering why the system was doing so much charging first, even going all the way to 100%. It did not charge the battery to 85% all at once though, this was done on cheap hours. Once it reached 85% it operated between 85 en 100% but never less than 85%! If you would want to charge to your desired SOC immediately I guess checking keep batteries charged until you are there does the trick. I hope this answers your question.

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kositch anonimoes commented · Apr 09 at 03:55 PM

Thanks I am asking because during night, when EV charges NodeRed automation sets min SoC to current SoC to disable battery discharge to EV. After EV finnishes, it reverts back min SoC setting (usually I use 20%). So I am wondering what this automation causes to DESS, @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) - what would you say, I think it should not to anything when this happens only during night for a few hours before EV finnishes.

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anonimoes kositch commented · Apr 09 at 07:15 PM

I would think that unless DESS was planning to discharge the battery during the charging of the vehicle (either to grid, or to power loads) the battery will not discharge if you start charging your car anyway when DESS is enabled. It will keep the SOC at the level it wants it to be and let the grid charge the car. In my case DESS will usually not power loads during the night since prices are usually low at that point.

At my site I have implemented strategies to prevent the problem the other way around: the car would soak op a discharge of DESS at a point where prices are high because the charger sees a surplus energy, thinks this is solar, and started charging. This made me disable the charger when prices are high.

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ajers commented · Apr 10 at 05:55 PM

Coming from Denmark I am really missing the varying service fees based on the time of day, since the price difference from peak/non peak is so big, that it's hard to optimize ESS without this.

Hope you prioritise this soon. Thanks.

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sarowe commented · Apr 11 at 02:28 PM

Ich würde gerne mal eine Frage auf Deutsch stellen und würde mich über eine deutliche Stellungnahme von Victron freuen. In verschiedenen Internetforen wird immer wieder behauptet das das DESS für den deutschen Markt nicht zulässig ist, weil es das sogenannte "Greenwashing" nicht völlig ausschließen kann.

Für eine Antwort wäre ich dankbar

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ sarowe commented · Apr 17 at 09:23 AM

We have added the restriction "Disable discharging battery to grid" to adhere to the German market rules. That should be sufficient. If there is a need to get this certified, please share the info on where to arrange that.

With German Google translate:
Um die deutschen Marktregeln einzuhalten, haben wir die Einschränkung „Entladen der Batterie ins Netz deaktivieren“ hinzugefügt. Das sollte ausreichen. Wenn dies bescheinigt werden muss, teilen Sie uns bitte mit, wo dies erfolgen kann.

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sarowe Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 17 at 07:48 PM

Danke.....mir reicht die Aussage völlig

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dirk-s sarowe commented · Apr 13 at 02:34 PM

Da gab es ja schon Streit in dem deutschen Forum. Da wird Victron als ausländisches Unternehmen erst recht nichts sagen können. Wenn Du Verkauf aus Batterie in das Netz verhinderst, kann es kein Greenwashing sein. Meine Meinung.

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sarowe dirk-s commented · Apr 14 at 07:09 AM

Ich als Nulleinspeiser habe das Problem auch nicht. Ich habe schon vor DESS ganz bewusst auf EEG Vergütung verzichtet. Allerdings würde ich mir eine Klarstellung von Victron wünschen

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brixnmorta commented · Apr 13 at 11:50 AM

Off peak DESS schedule needs more granularity please. I cannot change my supplier's timeclock. My off-peak cheap rate comes on at 5 minutes past the hour which I can accommodate when I set a Scheduled charge level in ESS. I turn the charge on at 6 minutes past and off at 4 minutes past the hour to ensure there is no under-run/over-run. In DESS, with only whole and half hour choices for setting the Fixed Price schedule, I don't want to enable the schedule on the whole hour to commence charging at the high rate from 00 minutes to 06 minutes.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ brixnmorta commented · Apr 17 at 02:02 PM

At the moment there are no plans for the VRM implementation to make the granularity 5 minutes. So that leaves three options:
- get creative with the Node-RED implementation
- offset the time on the GX device by 5 minutes
- ask the provider to switch at the whole hour

Using the Node-RED implementation is probably easiest. In order to do so, you only need to change the `start` and `end` for each schedule by adding 300 to it.

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Rasmus Mikkelsen commented · Apr 16 at 12:09 PM

Another question or possible bug? I have disabled charging battery from grid, but it is pulling 300ish watts atm from grid? My SoC is currently 90% and it has a forecast of 100% so probably why its doing that. But It shouldnt, as Ive turned it off?

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kdmn commented · Apr 17 at 05:57 AM

Hello,

I see some strange behavior with DESS dumping the battery in middle of the night to the grid when prices are low to then have an empty battery during peak morning price. I have seen this behavior on multiple days. Anyone else see this behavior? System is running now 14 days, maybe too early?

One explanation I could see is that Victron is offering grid balancing services with the pool of batteries they have under control, so I would like to see a confirmation this is not the case?

Image Caption

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ kdmn commented · Apr 17 at 09:03 AM

First of all I can assure you that we are not offering grid balancing services.

And I agree that "battery to grid" blob there is strange and feels wrong. I believe this was caused by the consumption forecast being off, where the forecast was more than you actually used and, in order to reach the target SOC, it decided to sell the excess.

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johanbakker Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 22 at 12:28 PM

Hi Dirk-Jan,

Have been using DESS for a week now and love the functionality!

But now and than i also see some unexplained behaviour, where during the day, at the lowest tarif, about 30-40% of the PV is sent to the Grid, while the batteries are far from full (and probably will not become full due to clouds).

This behaviour is not part of the plan for the day, where it says all PV will go to the batteries.

Any idea why the system is sending PV to the Grid at a very low tarif, as it makes much more sense to store it in the batteries.

Regards, Johan

c0619ab36ed2

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johanbakker johanbakker commented · Apr 22 at 02:28 PM

Hoi Dirk-Jan,

I just upgraded the Cerbo-GX to v3.31 and the feeding of PV to the Grid at low tariffs and half full batteries has stopped :-) Not sure if this a coincidence, but i will keep an eye on it and let you know if it returns.

Regards, Johan

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yolev-energie commented · Apr 17 at 11:36 AM

Goedemiddag,

Is het ook zo in te stellen (of in VRM op te nemen) dat je in één oogopslag de kosten en baten kunt zien van de planning? Dus Grid Earnings minus Batterijkosten en Grid Kosten = € xx,xx

Dan hoef je niet alles uit te rekenen als je een keer kijkt in de VRM DESS.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ yolev-energie commented · Apr 17 at 02:03 PM

Good idea. I've created an issue for this to add a summary to the graph.

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yolev-energie Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Apr 17 at 02:54 PM

Dank voor je snelle antwoord! Mooi om op deze manier te kunnen dragen aan mooie jullie systeem.

Zien we t.z.t. de update vanzelf verschijnen in VRM?

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manfred-2 commented · Apr 18 at 01:02 PM

Hello

I think, the Forecost uses incorrect times for the calculation of Load and Unload. Daylight saving time is not taken into account.

The time is displayed correctly in the remote console.

I have an electricity tariff where the price changes at 6:00 and 22:00. In the forcast, however, you can see that the start and stop points are set to 5:00 and 21:00.
This means that electricity is consumed at the high tariff, even though there is still enough energy in the storage system.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ manfred-2 commented · Apr 30 at 10:07 AM

Sorry that it took a while to look into this. At the moment we can't reproduce this (and you have dynamic ESS switched off). It is also a bit unclear at which day the screenshots where taken.

We did notice that you switched Dynamic ESS a few times on and off. It performs best if you leave it running for a longer while without switching it off.

If you still notice it, feel free to tag me. That usually helps in getting my attention.

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rodeo123 commented · Apr 22 at 04:48 PM

I dont get the DESS Button activated in the VRM. Does it come from my Shelly 3em pro used as grid meter?

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kudos50 rodeo123 commented · Apr 30 at 04:27 PM

Nope, I use 3 of them. All good.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ rodeo123 commented · May 01 at 11:44 AM

Just checked your site. It looks like it is good to go, all you need to do is activate it via the controls panel on the top right corner of VRM.

And then click the Dynamic ESS slider

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ronaldt commented · Apr 22 at 05:30 PM

I have installed node-red implementation 0.1.19 with the option of Green mode. But now I am always in green mode (I think?). Switching on or off does not make a difference. And also switching to DESS on VRM (version 3.40-2) does not change the situation. Now it loads from PV and for some reason it is not selling for the highest price anymore. I don't get it to go back to it's 'normal' behaviour anymore. VRM dashboard show No data to display.

Any ideas?

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kudos50 commented · Apr 22 at 08:47 PM

Do we have fellow DESS users out there running with a healthy mix of solar inverters and solar chargers ?

I has been quiet for a while now concerning a feature request in DESS to handle solar yield from inverters different than charger. The last comment from Dirk-Jan was that it's still an internal discussion I think.

For me nothing has changed since the original post. Battery costs aside, Inverter PV has a ~20% efficiency loss going in and back out. Charger PV on the other hand is ~98% efficient and Inverter losses should not be used for charger calculations as you need to invert sometime anyway (i.e you do not include Inverter PV efficiency loss either how ever little that number is).

With recent dynamic pricing in the Netherlands that means it's better to store charger PV into the battery almost all day every day. While waiting for Victron development to verdict on the matter, I wrote a flow that sums (ac_loads + critical_loads - pv_inverter) and if negative it sets max grid fead-in to the nearest 200W. That was the easy part. Writing logic to determine when not to do that to not interfere with DESS planning was a whole lot harder but all seems to be working fine.

I have read other users running a flow to disable the inverter entirely by day but I'm using ESS peak-shaving which breaks without inverter power.

Would be good to share some thoughts with other users that have a similar setup.

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kudos50 commented · Apr 23 at 09:25 AM

Uhhh.... No it hasn't. In fact; never touched it again after setting it !

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broesel commented · Apr 23 at 05:56 PM

Hi!

As soon as i enable DESS and sun gets less my System takes from Grid - ebenbürtig Batterie is at 100%.

Why?

That does not make Sense!

Daniel

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ahtih commented · Apr 24 at 05:45 AM

Hi,

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

Is there a setting I can use to exclude EVCS consumption from DESS calculations?

I recently installed Grid meter (VM-3P75CT) and now consumption is very high. EVCS is installed in AC-IN. All other loads are in AC-Out of 3x MP-II.

DESS is most of the time trying to keep battery at 100% SOC but since actual consumption is much lower than predicted then PV is throttled down to 0 and grid is used.

Site 48e7da86cd8b and currently running DESS via Node-Red. Grid feed-in is disabled.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ ahtih commented · Apr 27 at 02:24 PM

I am afraid there is no such setting yet. Though the Node-RED implementation does allow flexibility by changing the schedule based on your own rules.

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onur-b commented · May 01 at 01:21 PM

Hello,

My VRM is 2551337.

I suspect Dynamic ESS uses the absolute value of the electricity buy/sell price as today between 13h-15h the buy/sell price for electricity for Tibber/NL is around -9 cents/kWh, the grid costs for those time frame is shown as negative whereas it should have been positive.

Also please see below today's buy/sell chart

Also the system should have sold back to the grid till 13h whereas it filled the batteries before and tried to keep the grid buy around 0 most of the negative hours.

I hope you can fix this soon.

Regards,

Onur

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ onur-b commented · May 01 at 01:52 PM

The costs / earnings graph is acting wrongly here. We are looking into that. The system did what it should and charged the battery from grid during the negative price period.

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onur-b Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · May 01 at 03:24 PM

Thank you for the swift response Dirk.

I can see the system charged the battery during negative hours but it also did so between 12h-13h where the price was at positive (albeit very low). Is there any reason for that rather than not charging the battery at all between 12h-13h (and selling back the excess during that time frame) and charge the battery from the grid more between 13h-15h?

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marceldb commented · May 02 at 01:25 PM

Why does DESS turn off the SmartSolar when the battery is full? The SmartSolar stops producing when I turn on DESS. When I turn off DESS it starts producing again. There is no limitation on feeding to grid.

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kudos50 marceldb commented · May 03 at 08:31 AM

I have this issue but only for a short while. After a few mins it starts producing again. I have a feeling it happens when the RS switches from bulk to absorption.

My issue may not be related at all but please give it a try :-)

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jesperfalkebo marceldb commented · May 03 at 10:40 AM

I'm also using DESS and I had the same problem. Enabling DVCC solved it.

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dutchsolarfreak jesperfalkebo commented · May 03 at 11:48 AM

@JesperFalkebo

Could you please share a screenshot of your DVCC settings in de CerboGX?

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jesperfalkebo dutchsolarfreak commented · May 03 at 11:58 AM

Sure but it's pretty much just the defaults

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dutchsolarfreak jesperfalkebo commented · May 03 at 12:34 PM

Thanks

Is there any particular reason why you didn't enable the battery charge voltage? Disabled/switched off means it takes the value from the BMS/battery?

And in your case the CCL from the battery is overwritten by you with the value 149A?

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marceldb jesperfalkebo commented · May 11 at 01:26 PM

DVCC is on, but still no solar production.

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marceldb marceldb commented · May 11 at 01:28 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Would you please answer this question?

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marceldb marceldb commented · Jun 10 at 12:16 PM

I found the answer myself: When the battery is full and the electricity price is negative, the SmartSolar turns off.

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dutchsolarfreak commented · May 03 at 08:04 AM

Hello

A question from "yet another guy who tries to understand DESS"

I follow this topic for a few months. I have a new setup and I want to activate DESS.

I have one 5k MP, RS/100 charger and a few AC coupled PV's. My battery has an capacity of 30Kwh. My vrmid = 360507

I configured DESS like this (as a start):

The planning/prediction for today looks good to me:

If I understand the above data correct I assume my battery will be used to power my house, and deliver some amps to the net.

As soon as I activate DESS it starts discharging my battery with 2,5kW to the grid.

Why discharging with 2,5kW? 2,5kW is way higher than the configured limit of 1kW?

So why DESS is not respecting the limits?

I waited until the next hour and according to the planning no energy from the battery should be delivered to the grid.

BUT still it is discharging my battery to the grid?!?

Did I make some mistake? Or do I miss something?

I hope someone can help me try to understand DESS.

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kudos50 dutchsolarfreak commented · May 03 at 08:26 AM

Not sure but I think this is in the DESS documentation; the config in the DESS page is for calculations only. It does not set the actual system limits.

For example, my system is set to a 17kW grid connection with 6000W invert and 6000W charge for a 40kW battery.

I actually configured the 6000W as an ESS inverter limit as well. And I use a node-red flow to limit the DVCC charge current to 81A + whatever the current the MPPT RS generates.

There is no such thing as exact science. Find the values that work for you. Which in your case is complicated by the mix between AC and DC PV like I have.

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dutchsolarfreak kudos50 commented · May 03 at 09:08 AM

Okay make sense. Although I think its a bit confusing.

So it seems that DESS takes the charge/discharge ESS limits.

But I don't understand why my battery is dischared to the grid (with 2,5kW) as soon as I activate DESS. The planning/forecast says use solar/net

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kudos50 dutchsolarfreak commented · May 03 at 09:27 AM

Not sure why it starts the charge. What does the soc% forecast say ?

Also, uncharted territory for me as I use DVCC. The charge limit option under ESS in the screenshot is new to me. Normally DVCC controls the charge limits across various Victron chargers like MultiPlus and MPPT RS

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dutchsolarfreak kudos50 commented · May 03 at 09:48 AM

I enabled DESS again, and now it seems to run correct. At least according to the prediction: use grid and solar for load. No grid feed-in right now. I'll let it run now for a while and see if it run according to the prediction......

Regarding DVCC: I didn't enable it yet since it's not clear to me what will happen in case my battery is full and 3000W DC solar power is produced and I limit my MP to 2500W (charge). Will RS be throttled down to 2500 or 500W (3000-2500) will flow to the grid?

I need to test this.

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colinsplaat dutchsolarfreak commented · May 03 at 08:29 AM

Ik heb een vergelijkbare opstelling en ook hier gaat het niet goed. Ook 2,5kw ontladen en settings worden niet gerespecteerd.

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dutchsolarfreak colinsplaat commented · May 03 at 09:08 AM

Dank Ik ben blijkbaar niet de enige.

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roman-trnka commented · May 03 at 12:51 PM

I have tried DESS and have currently two issues. Situation today is quite normal. One peak of price in the morning, the second at the late afternoon. At about 10 AM the situation is:

SoC 52% already for a couple of hours and the project is to keep the SoC
Battery price is set to 0,08 Euro/kWh, selling price is 0,15 Euro, buying price 0,4 Euro

On this circumstances my suggestion would be use solar or a battery if needed (washing machine or dishwasher for example) and charge the battery during the midday when the price is low. DESS decided to keep the battery and buy enery from grid. Why? I cannot see the point.

If the strategy is to keep the battery as it was projected I have another issue. I am using an electric boiler which is warmed up above 90% of SOC of battery (3x1 kW heater which switch on one by one at 90%, 95% and 100% od SoC respectively). In this case I wouldn't have a warm water at all. I need a battery to be charged to 100% everyday if possible (enough solar energy).

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ronaldt commented · May 04 at 07:10 PM

Too strict on SOC

The SOC is calculated upfront. It is a good guess. But the real situation is heavily influenced by incidents like less/more energy input (sun), more energy usage (houseconsumption, heatpump, EV charger). This results in stop charging/discharging when SOC is reached. So precious Solar energy is sent to the grid for 0 (or worse) cents/kwh. Or export to grid is stopped when the price is high, and continues the next hour when the price is lower.
In my perception it would be better to have a 'soft SOC'. When the price is high sell, when low buy/charge. If you overshoot the target you will get more benefit.

See example below where I noticed that at 20:52 the export was stopped, and at 21:00 it continued (for a lower price).
Today I had the same where solar was send to the grid for a very low price until I switched to Green mode. But Green Mode sells the energy not for the highes price, so that needs some tweaking too.
@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) What is in the planning for this, and where can we report back on Green Mode (Node-red) observations.

Target SOC was 26%

When I switched Green Mode on, the system exports only after the peak price.

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zonnigbreda ronaldt commented · May 06 at 08:41 AM

I also struggle with the ' too strict' adhearance to the target SOC, when the consumption or the feed-in differs from the predicted values.
While when updated the calulated scheduled buy/sell seems logical, when actual is different from consumption I see undesired buying & selling.

I indeed wish this would be handled better, either by soft(er) targets or change the logic so per hour it either buys, sells or nothing (for all of the hours where it calculates it does not want to buy/sell).

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ ronaldt commented · May 13 at 10:28 AM

This is the place to report things. I do try to read all of the comments (won't / can't react to all of them though).

As you seem to be running the Node-RED implementation, it isn't too hard to make the system even more dynamic. Harold Halewijn released a YouTube clip on how to get started with that.

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oskar commented · May 08 at 11:16 AM

Thoughts on latest version v3.31.
Nice with 2 operating modes.

I would like a third (3) mode also --> Money & equipment saver: Buy as little as possible, just enough to be able to survive on battery until solar comes back on in the morning.
There is no need to load the battery to 100% with grid, if you not are down on the SOC level.

I would prefer if it also would be a setting to select that only load battery with PV charger DC-DC and not PV inverter AC-DC.

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oskar oskar commented · May 08 at 11:20 AM

In previous versions if I selected No on selling to grid, it only charged the battery with the PV charger (if it reached max charged level on DESS) and still sold everything from PV inverter. (a version that worked kind of good for me).

The v3.31 doesn´t not care if I have a max charge level on DESS.

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kudos50 oskar commented · May 08 at 12:28 PM

Fully agree on the DC-PV to battery difference with AC-PV and associated losses. As stated in other posts and topics, it's hard to gather all the votes in favour of this. Thereby leaving this request kind of scattered all over the community.

For Victron it probably isn't worth developing if target audience (people with both AC and DC PV) is too small OR have use-cases and grid operators/pricing structures making the advantage of having this negligible.

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marceldb commented · May 12 at 04:40 PM

This is strange: sell and buy price formulas are 100% equal, but in the chart there is a 15 cent difference. I turned on and off DESS, changed the formulas, ctrl-F5 refreshed screen and so on, but this remains. This happens also at other sites that I manage. The graph does not change

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ marceldb commented · May 13 at 12:45 PM

I tried to reproduce this, but failed so far. Which site is this? And are you testing on the regular VRM site?

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kjell commented · May 19 at 12:30 PM

I would like to see a user input on scheduled charging of EV, hours and effect, this should make it easier to predict consumption.

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Petr LANDSFELD commented · May 20 at 05:12 PM

Sorry, but it doesn't work correctly. It is charging my battery from grid even if sun is shining and consume grid energy instead of battery or sun energy directly. It doesn't matter if green or trade mode. Same mistake. I have to manage it manually to work with it as I need. It is sad.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Petr LANDSFELD commented · May 21 at 02:36 PM

Can you share your vrm id, so I can take a look at you configuration?

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stellar-energy commented · May 21 at 01:28 PM

VRM portal ID : c0619ab2f1f9

This 3-phase dynamic ESS system was set up with Dynamic ESS first rthing after configuring the 3 Multiplus inverters on the L1 L2 and L3 phase.

Everything works fine, however I keep getting the alarm saying "ESS functionaloty not available. All functions including Dynamic ESS seem to work though. When I disable and enable Dynamic ESS in the VRM , the Arlarm will go away for anywhere within 2 and 48 hours. Again, all seems to work fine ...

Anyone can shine his / her light on this situation? I am out of ideas.

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grua stellar-energy commented · May 21 at 02:22 PM

Do you have a Cerbo or a Raspberry Pi with Venus OS? I Have the same message in an 1-phase ESS. The cause is the Raspi:

If I switch off the Raspi with DESS activated, this message appears when I switch it on again.

If I switch it off with DESS not activated, the message doesn't appear.

I think @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) knows this Issue, but I don't know if they will implement a fix for that because Raspberry Pi isn't supported officially...

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stellar-energy grua commented · May 21 at 07:00 PM

I am using a Multiplus II 5000 GX. So not Raspberry or otherwise unsupported Venus device

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ stellar-energy commented · May 22 at 12:57 PM

This is an actual bug in the code, which does occur, mainly on larger systems. We already fixed it in the latest beta feed and it will be backported to 3.32 (when that is released).

The work-a-round at the moment is to log into the os and do a `svc -t /service/dbus-systemcalc-py` once the system has booted.
As this system has remote support enabled, I already did that for this system.

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stellar-energy Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · May 24 at 10:23 AM

Hey Thanks Dirk-Jan!

Quite happy to know that it is at least not something I did wrong in the installation ;-)

The problem did remain though. Also after a reboot of VenusOS. Any other things that I can try? Or should I wait for the next update?

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donhall44 commented · May 21 at 06:06 PM

Just starting out on the dynamic ESS journey and I am unable to configure it! In the Buy Prices dropdown box for Country, there is no option for UK (or even GB). Is Dynamic ESS not available in the UK?

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donhall44 donhall44 commented · May 23 at 08:49 AM

Unfortunately this doesn't work for me - Alt/Option + F10 doesn't open anything on either my Macbook or PC and my iPad doesn't have function keys on it's on-screen keyboard.

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ojack commented · May 22 at 02:45 PM

Wow, that's great. With only about 2.5kWh predicted yield for the rest of the day, just over 3kWh of loads will be powered and around 4kWh will be charged into the battery up to 100% SoC. Incredibly cool ;-)

Please do not take this as a particularly serious criticism. I just happened to notice it.

I know how difficult it is to make a forecast, especially when the weather today is quite a bit worse than predicted yesterday.

I think the System did a good job today and the battery is large enough to cover that rainy day. Generally at the moment there is no advantage with DESS when having constant sell price and no need for buying a single kWh from grid from April to Oktober.

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stegzzz commented · May 25 at 03:37 PM

I've been running dess for a couple of weeks and mostly it is working very well, thank you for this! But, I am repeatedly getting ess functionality alarms, some lasting several hours, please see attached. Any ideas on this?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ stegzzz commented · May 27 at 10:09 AM

This was a bug and has been fixed in the, just released, v3.32.

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stegzzz Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 09 at 07:30 PM

Thanks, I've updated and will post back here if this is still an issue. An additional point, I think the errors were only occurring in green mode.

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adj commented · May 31 at 05:00 AM

When using DESS there is a nice graph showing cost and earnings. I'd like to see the cumulative values over time. Does anyone have a tip how to get that information?

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Henrik Känngård commented · Jun 04 at 11:02 AM

Hi!
I don't see that it has been mentioned. But yesterday the dynamic price for my installation changed from price per hour to price per half hour. I see this is something which was being developed for the future, but now my installation got it without the possibility to change to hourly price and also the forecast for the price looks a bit strange, since my region does not support price per half hour.
Info about my installation:
VRM portal ID: c8df84d34272
I attach a screenshot of the price for today bellow.

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Henrik Känngård Henrik Känngård commented · Jun 04 at 12:54 PM

I have also reacted on that sometimes the system buy eneregy from the grid for no reason, like right now. See image for reference. I have enough SOC to last until tomorrow and the price is not low enough to be able to sell back this energy at a higher cost later on.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ Henrik Känngård commented · Jun 04 at 01:18 PM

Hej Henrik. That was a (visual) bug from our side when implementing the change on the half hour (as the UK uses) and only present on beta VRM. That has been fixed now.
For regular use the normal VRM site is the better option. On beta VRM we do test (and sometimes break) stuff.

For your other remark, on buying the energy now to sell later on. Probably the solar yield was a bit lower than the system expected, but I'll have a colleague look into why that happened.
You might also consider switching to the Green mode.

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gr1pen Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 05 at 11:07 AM

I have tried Green Mode but switched back to Trade Mode. As I see it, Green Mode is more benificial when the spot price is quite static during the known period. If the spot prices varies, Trade Mode would (or could) be more benificial.

I would like to request a setting to control the balance between Green/Trade (or have it switch automatically between the two modes depending on the changes in the spot price).

I can do this with Node Red, but I think it would be really nice to have it in VRM, since I rather use that.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ gr1pen commented · Jun 05 at 11:36 AM

At the moment that is even hard to do in Node-RED. The next beta release of Venus will make it a lot easier. I'll post a new article on how to do that when that release is out.

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Henrik Känngård Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 05 at 10:51 AM

Thank you for clarifying. Yes, I will try green mode to see how it works for a while :)

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john245 commented · Jun 13 at 10:34 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

I'm on trading mode but it seems that the system tries to keep the setpoint at 0. This is not efficient.

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john245 john245 commented · Jun 16 at 05:08 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

16JUN2023

Whys sending to grid from 23:00 - 23:59. Tariff is 26 cent while the hour before the tariff is 30 cent. This is not efficient. I'm on trading mode. Since a couple of days I see this strange behavior.

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anonimoes commented · Jun 17 at 07:10 PM

DESS has been running very nicely the last two months or so, overall I'm very happy with it! I have been on holiday in the meantime and it just works, also when I'm not at home :)

I do still experience one issue though: When my Enyaq starts a 3-phase charge the battery starts to discharge even though the peakshaving limit is not reached, or battery charging is slowed down when charging a 1 phase car on phase 2. The battery and multiplus II are on phase 1.

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) : would you be able to look into this? My site ID is: c0619ab343b0

I have set my peakshaving import limit at 23A, export at 25A. Since my multiplus is behind a 16A breaker the grid current limit is set to 17A.

I saw the mentioned behaviour while doing a 3-phase charge last night.

One example of single phase charging last saturday during the day:

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anonimoes anonimoes commented · Jun 27 at 08:21 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) : I guess you overlooked my above post as you are very busy answering all the questions on this forum. Thanks for al your hard work on DESS! I'm still experiencing the above issue, even after upgrading the firmware in the multi to the latest version. All other hardware was already at the newest firmware.

would you please be able to look into this? My site ID is: c0619ab343b0

I have set my peakshaving import limit for ESS at 24A (to allow my car charger to charge as fast as possible), export at 25A. Since my multiplus is behind a 16A breaker the current limit for the multi is set to 17A (16A effectively).

After the firmware upgrade I saw the behaviour yesterday afternoon while doing a 3 phase charge on the car. Today I will be charging single phase on L2 and expect to see the charging of the battery to slow down (on L1).

I understand that the forecasting will be off when charging cars / having big loads that are difficult to predict and am completely fine with that.

What I would expect though, is that DESS will take advantage of the unused grid connection to at least try to get to the predicted SOC. In my case this would mean that while charging a single-phase car on L2, the battery should not experience any reduction in charging speed as it is on L1. While doing a three phase charge with 16A per phase, the remaining 8A on phase one should still be used for charging the battery, or am I mistaken?

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anonimoes anonimoes commented · Jun 27 at 04:18 PM

To add to the above information: I think I might know what is happening here, maybe this is specific to having a single phase multi/battery on a three phase grid connection. Today I observed that the multi tries to keep the entire grid connection (3 phases together) at the set limit for peakshaving. As solar production went up or down, charging went up and down as well. Then I tried starting the car charger with less solar just now in the afternoon and very soon the battery started to discharge a little to keep the grid connection as a total at 24 amps. As soon as I raised the import setting for peakshaving to 40 amps the battery started charging again.

To summarise: I suspect that my system is applying the peakshaving limit to the total of the three phases and not for every phase separately. Maybe because the multi / battery system is just a single phase system and my grid connection has three phases?

I could just go and raise the peakshaving limit to 75 amps of course, but this would kind of defeat the purpose of this setting as a protection for individual phases. In my case DESS / ESS / the multi should only care about phase 1, as this is the only phase it can influence.

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) : I suspect this might actually be a bug in the peakshaving implementation? Or did I get my settings wrong?

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ anonimoes commented · Jun 27 at 06:45 PM

Thanks for the full report. I've now seen it and will take action upon it.

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kositch commented · Jun 18 at 05:22 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) Hello Dirk, we (Czech republic + Slovakia) are still waiting for possibility to set different price formulas for dynamic prices during the day (same as it is possible for fixed prices, but to be able set different dynamic price formulas to each hour). It is Go - No Go criteria for us, because price difference for distribution of electricity differs in tenths of % during the day which affects final price more than dynamic price changes during the day. And please add also the possibility to "zero" negative dynamic prices, because we have some providers which charge 0 for dynamic price instead of negative value, than I think lots of customers can start using DESS. Thanks for the update, when it will be implemented, I know you are cooperating with Neosolar distributor and I think they are also willing to help implementing this.

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simonyoungtree commented · Jun 19 at 01:28 PM

Today, at 15:25h, pricing info for next day is missing "no data to display".

Perhaps use an average of last 14 days for pricing (until the real data re available) to have a bit better planning of DESS for the existing day?

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john245 simonyoungtree commented · Jun 19 at 03:09 PM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy)

19JUN2024

System is in trading mode. Currently charging the battery with expensive energy while the energy was 4 cent cheaper earlier today.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ john245 commented · Jun 20 at 09:29 AM

Not sure if I what moment of yesterday you are referring to that the energy was cheaper. I see that your system charged from the grid between 14:00 and 16:00, which to me seems to be the "valley" of the day.

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john245 Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ commented · Jun 20 at 11:00 AM

@Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) The Now is displayed at 17:00. The system had the possibility to charge the battery earlier during the day at cheaper prices. Furthermore, the system is not unloading the energy at the highest price but will unload during a couple of hours. In which case a number of these hours are way less expensive.

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Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) ♦♦ john245 commented · Jun 20 at 11:29 AM

You mean that 0.2 kWh that was taken between 17:00 and 18:00 yesterday?

It is probably due to a slight offset between forecast and actual consumption and/or solar yield.
I consider this an marginal error, still correcting for that offset during a relative cheap moment. I am sure the system will always have minor offsets. But indeed, you could have saved an extra € 0.04 * 0.2 = € 0.008.

Then for the discharging taking more time than just the best hour for selling back. In your battery settings, you've set the maximum discharge power to 9.6 kW, which it also almost reached (9.18). If your system can handle it, increasing that setting will help it discharge more quickly.

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falkon commented · Jun 25 at 11:12 PM

Dear Victron saff, first of all: Thank you for your great work on this DESS system!

As all new technologies, especially such complex things as DESS, it requires quite a bit of work and time to test and polish out all the corner-cases, and to keep everything homogeneous and in-line with fast development.

Is there any "ticketing system" where some "power users" can place their technical suggestions what to fix and/or what to enhance?

I would like to contribute at least with some findings which I believe may be useful also for others. Or, do you prefer that even small suggestions for enhancements to be placed here on the forum?

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ronaldt commented · Jul 02 at 01:52 PM

Not selling for the best price.

Today (2-7-2024) the system plans to sell at the end of the period in a timeframe that is not optimal while there are plenty of possibilities to sell earlier (e.g. at 43, 45) for a better price. That is probably unwanted behaviour. See below the blue arrows for the right moment, but the red arrow for the wrong moment (I suppose).

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ronaldt ronaldt commented · Jul 03 at 05:59 AM

I have found the issue. My minimum SOC at 22:00 is 20%. Because I want to save some energy that I can use in the night myself or in case of an outage. But the system is so eager to sell all the energy in the battery, that after 23:00 it decides to sell what I have saved. That is not what I wanted... So this setting is sort of useless for this usecase. And I don't know where it can be used.

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lucode commented · Jul 09 at 03:00 PM

My VRM Portal ID: 780473a65c81
Venus OS : V3,33

I did setup DESS in my no-feedin setup (EasySolar 5000) with fixed tariffs. Unfortunately I experienced issues of which one is critical.

The system does feed into the grid even that I assume I have set the correct parameters. Usually I only had same peaks of feed-in, but with DESS it did feed-in 2kW for more than 20 min. I did need to uninstall DESS to prevent this, even setting DESS to off on the Venus settings didn't changed that behavior.
In my opinion the SOC has been regulate to very high levels, which did prevent using my own solar production over night. In other words if the weather forecast for the next day is high I would assume that I can discharge the battery over night completely if I need to.

Here are some screenshots:

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ronaldt commented · Jul 18 at 03:10 PM

Selling too much VP to the grid

If I make a calculation with the values below it would be better to store the energy of the VP in the battery and sell it later for a better price. I guess (But @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy knows for sure) that the calculation is based on buying and selling from the grid and does not take into account the PV energy you do not have to buy and has the value of the current sale price.

The system now sells back at 16:00 to the grid for € 0,063 / kWh. It has the opportunity to sell later for a higher price but it does not. When the price is € 0,114 and I take into account the € 0,02 batterycost and 90% efficiency the € 0,114 sell price is still € 0,0846 which is higher then the € 0,063 I am getting now.

The situation at 10:00 was even worse with a sell price of € 0,058

Is the 'free' PV energy not taken into account like this? Or am I doing something wrong?

Situation on 18-7-2024 17:00

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dirknie commented · Jul 21 at 08:49 AM

Hi,

ich nutze die DESS Funktion schon seit der Beta Phase und bin ziemlich zufrieden mit der Steuerung. Ich habe aber ein paar Punkte die ich vermisse oder vielleicht auch in den ganzen Posts über lesen habe.

1. mein System praktiziert jetzt schon seit ein paar Tagen einen BatterieLadungsausgleich was ich ünerhaupt nicht verstehe wo ich doch ohne Batterie Optimierung eingestellt habe. Wieso kann man das nicht manuell abschalten?

2. ich vermisse einfach nur den allgemeinen Anzeigewwert was die aktuelle Ladung des Akkus pro KW gekostet hat. Ich habe nämlich immer das Problem, dass der Verbrauch aus dem Akku ausgeglichen wird obwohl gefühlt das Akku zu einem höheren Preis geladen wurde.

3. Ich plane die Ladung meines Autos immer zu günstigen Bezugspreisen und dann fängt das Akku immer an auch Strom zu liefern, was ich eigentlich nicht will und mir den Akkuinhalt lieber für die teuren Tageszeiten afheben würde.Ich wünsche mir daher eine einfache Möglichkeit die Entladung zu verhindern. Gerne eine Kombination mit einem Preislevel, Kw-Preis der Akku Ladung und vielleicht auch Großverbrauchererkennung. Für Systeme mit großem Eigensolaranteil sieht so etwas sicherlich anders aus.

Cu Dirk

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ronaldt dirknie commented · Jul 21 at 10:06 AM

Hello Dirk,

For #3 I have implemented a Node-Red flow that based on if my charger is on scheduled charging (= when the grid price is low) it sets the grid point to such a value that the sum of PV and Gridpower is what is needed to charge the car. In that way the battery is not unloaded. This works because I have a Victron EV charger and I can read the values in Node-Red.

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dirknie ronaldt commented · Jul 21 at 10:19 AM

Hallo Ronald,

ich habe aktuell nur einen MP2 und ein Akku in Betrieb und keine Node-Red Spielereien. Es wäre schon Klasse wenn das VRM Portal etwas ausgebaut werden würde. Vielleicht gibt es ja ein paar Pläne in die Richtung.

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sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 11:23 AM

Ich muss hier nochmal auf Deutsch reingrätschen.

Nachdem. Die neue Software Version 3.40 rauswar, habe ich noch einmal beschlossen, das DESS zu testen. Die Verbrauchsprognose ist aus meiner Sicht immer noch eine Katastrophe. Samstag war viel mehr PV Produktion zu erwarten als Verbrauch. Daraufhin beschloss ich 2-3 Stunden Brennholz zu sägen (5 kw Leistung), das führte mal wieder dazu, dass sich die Verbrauchsprognose für den gesamten zukünftigen Verbrauch verdoppelt/verdreifacht hat. Das DESS kaufte trotz absehbaren PV Überschuss Energie aus dem Netz, ich konnte es gerade noch stoppen.

Heute das Gegenteil. Weil wir heute das E-Auto nicht wie üblich geladen haben, ist die Verbrauchsprognose nicht nur um die Energie des E-Autos nach unten gegangen, sondern auf nahezu Gar keinen Verbrauch.

Mir persönlich ist es ein Rätsel, warum Victron das nicht gelöst bekommt. Ein größerer spontaner Verbrauch oder Minderverbrauch führt immer wieder dazu, dass die gesamte Verbrauchsprognose explodiert.

Richtig wäre ein erhöhter Verbrauch vieleicht dazu führt das die Verbrauchsprognose für die nächsten 1-3 Stunden hoch geht aber sich doch nicht für das gesamte kommende Zeitintervall. Wozu braucht ihr dann die Durchschnitte der letzten 28 Tage für die Prognose.

Ich lese oft in verschiedenen Foren über das DESS und stoße immer wieder auf Fehlfunktionen, die meiner Meinung nach genau auf dieses Problem zurückzuführen sind.

Es ist so traurig. Viele der Funktionen und Entwicklungen laufen richtig gut. Es kann doch nicht sein das so ein Faktor das ganze Projekt so unbrauchbar macht.

Entschuldigung für die deutlichen Worte

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Peter sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 11:41 AM

Such things are only available in GbbOptimizer for now :-)

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sarowe Peter commented · Jul 21 at 11:51 AM

Und von den 10€ monatlichen Überschuss überweise ich dann 7€ Dir?

Danke

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Peter sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 12:15 PM

If don't want to pay 7eur/month you must have about 40-50kWh battery. If you have 40-50kWh battery do you really have only 10eur/month surplus? Customers with 40-50kWh have 10eur surplus but daily...

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sarowe Peter commented · Jul 21 at 12:23 PM

Ja ich habe 56 kwh Speicher.......

20-25000 kwh Verbrauch....

Den größten Gewinn erzeugt die Anlage schon ohne DESS. Allerdings würde ich es gerne zum laufen bringen.

Idealismus

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 12:44 PM

So ein Blödsinn kommt dabei raus. Obwohl wir immer 40-50 kwh täglich verbrauchen

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 01:33 PM

Solange solche Fehler in der Verbrauchsprognose auftreten wird das DESS nie richtige Entscheidung treffen. Egal welcher Modus oder nach welchen Kriterien. Die Verbrauchsprognose ändert sich dann im weiteren Verlauf wieder und keiner kann die Kauf oder Verkauf Entscheidung zu dem Zeitpunkt verstehen. Ich gehe davon auf das sehr viele auch weiter oben in diesem Threat auf die fehlerhafte Verbrauchsprognose zurück zu führen sind. Selbst wenn die Verbrauchsprognose nur auf den errechneten Durchschnitt der letzten 2-3 Wochen beruhen würde, wäre es genauer als das was momentan im System passiert.

So wie es zur Zeit läuft, verärgert und enttäuscht ihr nur eure Kunden.

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 05:49 PM

Das ganze Spiel 5 h später. Das System hat sich etwas wieder eingependelt auch noch immer nicht genug. Die Prognose hat sich mehr als verdoppelt. Das ganze nur weil das E-Auto gestern schon geladen wurde.

Genau das selbe passiert aber auch in die andere Richtung. Halbe Stunde kochen oder Wäschetrockner an und die Verbrauchsprognose geht ins unermessliche nach oben und braucht anschließend 3-5 h um sich wieder einzupendeln.

Das sind dann im schlimmsten Fall 4-5 Stunden völlige Fehlentscheidungen des DESS.

Das ist einfach nur Blödsinn

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 27 at 02:30 PM

Diese Wochenende das Gegenteil. Etwas mehr Verbrauch und die Prognose explodiert fürs gesamte Zeitintervall

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 27 at 06:14 PM

3 Stunden später die Verbrauchsprognose hat sich etwas relativiert, aber 3 Stunden mit völlig falschen Entscheidungen

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grua sarowe commented · Jul 28 at 11:01 AM

Also here. I NEVER had such high consumption over longer time. But only one or two hours with higher consumption leads to extremly high consumption forecast over the whole next days. @Dirk-Jan Faber (Victron Energy) that's really a very important issue which should be fixed as soon as possible.

Beside this, green mode does a great job!

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sarowe sarowe commented · Jul 21 at 05:57 PM

So und damit Entschuldige ich mich für die deutlichen Deutschen Worte und werde wieder zum erstmal stummen Mitleser. Ich musste das mal loswerden weil ich das Gefühl habe ihr arbeitet an den falschen Stellen.

Danke

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tom-deckers commented · Jul 23 at 02:31 PM

Hi, the price graph for DESS shows 'no data to diplay' on VRM. This is an easysolar II.

I have another setup with exactly the same setup which shows the price just fine. This is a multiplus II

(ignore the actual data - I was messing with the formula)

Any ideas how to get the graph for the first battery?

Thanks!
Tom.

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Andi commented · Jul 30 at 06:29 AM

"Für diesen Tag ist ein Batterieladungsausgleich geplant."

Bedeutet, das System will heute mit Strom aus dem öffentlichen Grid meine Zellen balancen?

Mein Akku wird von der Sonne heute eh wieder voll werden.

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Andi Andi commented · Jul 31 at 11:43 AM

Das klappt ja einwandfrei hier mit den Antworten.
Andi, du könntest den Batterieausgleich deaktivieren. Und zwar hier: In den ESS Einstellungen unter ->Batterie -> Bearbeiten->Batterieausgleich

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grua Andi commented · Jul 31 at 12:15 PM

Und wurde der Ausgleich nun tats. aus dem Netz geladen oder durch PV-Produktion?

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Andi grua commented · Jul 31 at 12:37 PM

Aus dem Netz wurde nichts geladen.
Gut das ich gerade Urlaub habe, und das ganze den ganzen Tag beobachten konnte.
Ich muss sagen, das der Ausgleich zur Zeit sowieso jeden Tag automatisch stattfindet, weil der Akku halt recht früh voll ist.
Diese Funktion (Batterieausgleich)ist eher was für den Winter, würd ich sagen. Deswegen hab ich es jetzt deaktiviert. Bevor das System noch auf dumme Gedacnken kommt und morgens um 8 den Ausglauch macht mit teurem Strom.

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grua Andi commented · Jul 31 at 02:05 PM

Also sobald egal wie (aus Netz oder durch PV) die 100% erreicht wurden, sollte das Zeitintervall ohnehin neu starten. Daher würde ich mir da keine Sorgen machen.

Ich hab DESS jetzt im Sommer aber generell deaktiviert, da ich derzeit mit PV und Speicher ohnehin autark bin.

Werde DESS grundsätzlich erst ab Herbst/Winter nutzen um automatisch die Batterie zu günstigen Zeiten vom Netz zu laden.

Bis dahin - Sonne genießen :-)

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hook commented · Aug 01 at 05:07 PM

Why does dynamic ESS limit charging and not only limit discharging, if energy is needed later on? In my opinion it should use all available solar power to store in the battery, regardless of all the predictions and the target SoC.

Here are some screenshots:

I have a dynamic price tariff for consumption, so it definitely makes sense to save some battery power for high price hours, but at the moment the battery is only charged to 41% and I'm selling 7kW of power to the grid and the battery doesn't get charged.

Dynamic ESS settings are:

Can you sell energy back to the grid?	Yes
Maximum import power	24 kW
Maximum export power	7 kW
Operating mode	Green mode

Battery capacity	14 kWh
Maximum discharge power	1.9 kW
Maximum charge power	1.9 kW
Estimated battery cycle life	4000
Battery price	€ 1500
Battery cycle costs per kWh	0.03 €/kWh
Battery balancing	On
Full charge interval	14 days
Do you want to restrict the battery usage?	No

Buy prices type	Dynamic
Energy provider country	Germany
Energy provider name	Tibber
Price calculation	(p+0.018+0.14)*1.19

In my opinion dynamic ESS should not follow strictly the target SoC, for times where the battery is not full yet and there is consumption later on, it should still be allowed to charge the battery, instead of selling the power for only 0,09€/kWh and buying back later for about 0,30€/kWh.

So in my opinion the main target should not be the "target SoC", instead dynamic ESS should limit charging or discharging at specific times, which in my opinion should work way better than just strictly following the target SoC.

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sarowe hook commented · Aug 01 at 07:06 PM

Batteriepreis 1500 € je kwh????

Ist das so richtig......?

Dabei versucht das System den Akku möglichst wenig zu nutzen.

Oder denke ich falsch?

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grua sarowe commented · Aug 01 at 08:17 PM

Er hat 0,03 EUR/kWh als Batteriekosten eingetragen. Nicht 1500 EUR/kWh.

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sarowe grua commented · Aug 02 at 03:10 AM

Batteriekosten 1500€

Kosten je Zyklus 0,03

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grua sarowe commented · Aug 02 at 05:16 AM

Du schriebst oben "1500 € je kWh", und das ist Quatsch. Daher meine obige Antwort.

DESS verwendet in seiner Planung ausschließlich den Wert 0,03 EUR/kWh und nicht den Wert 1500:

Man kann bei der DESS-Parametrierung wahlweise die Eingabefelder für Kaufpreis der Batterie und deren Gesamtzyklenzahl unsausgefüllt lassen und die Batteriekosten (in diesem konkreten Fall 0,03 EUR/kWh) direkt eintragen. Oder man lässt sich die Batteriekosten (in diesem konkreten Fall 0,03 EUR/kWh) vom DESS-Parametrierungsdialog errechnen. hook hat letzteres getan. Und DESS rechnet da bei der Eingabe der DESS-Eigenschaften folgendermaßen:

Seine Batterie mit 14 kWh Kapazität kostete insgesamt 1500 EUR und er erwartet eine Gesamt-Batterielebensdauer von 4000 Zyklen.

Bei insgesamt 4000 Zyklen und Kapazität 14 kWh sind das über die gesamte Batterielebensdauer 14 * 4000 = 56000 kWh, welche die Batterie über deren gesamten Lebensdauer leisten kann. Diese Gesamt-Lebensdauer von 56000 kWh hat ihm einmalig 1500 EUR gekostet. Somit kostet ihm eine einzige kWh dann 1500 / 56000 = 0,02678571 EUR bzw. gerundet 0,03 EUR. Also 0,03 EUR/kWh. Das sind die Batteriekosten, mit welchen DESS in der Planung jedes kWh der Batterie "bestraft": 0,03 EUR/kWh.

Also 0,03 EUR/kWh und nicht 0,03 EUR pro Zyklus!

Genauso gut hätte er gleich 0,03 EUR/kWh in den DESS-Eigenschaften eintragen können und die beiden Eingabefelder 1500 EUR und 4000 Zyklen unausgefüllt bleiben lassen.

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anonimoes commented · Aug 10 at 12:31 PM

The last two days or so my system has been behaving very erratically... It has been charging one our and discharging the next with less than one cent of price difference, short bursts of maximal discharging followed by slow charging in the same hour, charging the battery even though charging was not planned at al for that hour and also not discharging at the optimal (peek prices) intervals.

Does anybody encounter these issues as well? I've already restarted the Cerbo just to be sure and also checked that I'm on the latest firmware. Any ideas how to solve this?

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