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pedaaa avatar image
pedaaa asked

Victron ESS with Solaredge S16K on AC-Out?! Questions

Hello,

i am planning an ESS System in Europe/Austria. With 3xMultiplus II 5000 and Solaredge SE16K and Victron MPPT RS450/200. in general it should look like this:

1648493994430.png


I read through the Victron/Solaredge instructions, but still have some open questions:


1. Victron 1:1 Rule:

Sadly, there is no SE15K model available anymore. So the SE16K would be basically too big for installing it on AC-Out. But i think it should be somehow possible, to limit its output generally to 15kW. Then i think 1:1 rule is acceptable solved

2. Dry Contact:

If i understand it correctly, it would be sufficient to wire the first Multi K1 relay to the SE16K. If grid is lost, this relay will tell the SE16K to change to APS mode, correct?!


3. Victron grid meter and/or Solaredge smart meter needed?

I don´t understand, if a victron EM24 or some solaredge smart meter would be required or not?!

I do not have any loads or PV-inverters on AC-In. So basically the multis would not need any grid meter, correct?!

But does the SE16K need a Solar Edge smart meter? And if so, why? And which model?


4. zero feed in:

It might be possible, that the authority forces me to enable zero feed in, by an external NC contact. Would this be supported by Victron Multis?

input closed -> feed in allowed

input open -> zero feed in required

Will this work with EM24 or Solar Edge Smart meter?


thanks to everybody willing to help!

solaredge
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5 Answers
pedaaa avatar image
pedaaa answered ·

nobody any ideas?

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shaneyake avatar image
shaneyake answered ·

1. Victron 1:1 Rule:

16kw will be fine. Just only install 15kw and you shouldn't have any problems. If you can limit in software that would work too. But that is only slightly over 1:1 so should be fine.

2. Dry Contact:

This will work, just check to make sure your inverter supports dry contact. I know in the past we had to use the Power Plant Controller(PPC) to make that work but think that has changed on some models now.


3. Victron grid meter and/or Solaredge smart meter needed?

If there are no loads between grid and multiplus then no, you don't need a meter, however multiplus metering isn't very accurate so you might want an EM24 so the stats in VRM are perfect.

You might also need a solaredge meter if you want Zero feed in. But there are few ways to solve this problem.


4. zero feed in:

What country are you in? Some grid code settings let you have a contact for zero feed in this will however only control the victron inverters and not the solaredge. That will need to happen separately.

But you could just disconnect from grid completely when zero feed-in is active and only return at low SOC. This is one way to solve the Zero feed-in problem.

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pedaaa avatar image
pedaaa answered ·

Hello,

thank you for the very good answers.

I´ll give some feedback:


SE16K AC output power:

i will have 21,5kWp on the SE16K. It will not peak very often above 15kW output, but it still could do sometimes. But limiting it to 15kW in general should be easily possible.


Dry contact:

This is stil somehow confusing to me.

In this post:

https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/60678/feedback-on-victronsolaredge-documentation.html

they say, we should use "AUX relay " instead of K1.

What is the "Aux Relay" ???

I have no idea... is this the "ext.GND relay" on this picture?

1650022840819.png


Why would Victron have stated this wrong in their documentation for so long?

I am having hard times, to believe that...


Grid meters:

understand. So the EM24 is not required, but could make sense for more realistic values.

But for zero feed-in, a solaredge meter is requiered.

But the control for zero feed in must be done be Solaredge itself, Victron would need do it.


Last question to this:

there are different SE-grid meters available. Do you have a recommendation which one to use?


thank you again!!



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shaneyake avatar image shaneyake commented ·

SE16K AC output power:
Yeah, I wouldn't not do that 21.5kw on the SE16k can cause pretty big peaks on cloudy days. Since you don't have any DC coupled PV I would install 15kw on the Solaredge and install the 6.5kw on a RS 450/100 MPPT. This will be a more stable design, also you will be able to do a completely dead power up. Which you can't do if you only have AC coupled PV.

Dry contact:
The AUX relay is D (Blue connector) I would use that instead of K1.


Grid meters:

But for zero feed-in, a solaredge meter is requiered. Yes

But the control for zero feed in must be done be Solaredge itself, Victron would need do it.

Not sure what you mean by "Victron would need do it", But yes solaredge will need to manage zero feed in itself.


Last question to this:

there are different SE-grid meters available. Do you have a recommendation which one to use?
I would ask your supplier for best meter for your application.





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pedaaa avatar image
pedaaa answered ·

ok, i feel stupid now about the AUX relay... could have seen this myself, haha...

thanks

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7hvn avatar image
7hvn answered ·

With regard the use of the Aux relay (blue) to perform the frequency control of the SolarEdge inverter. How does one program the Aux relay to do this?

https://www.victronenergy.com/live/venus-os:gx_solaredge

The above instructions go to great length on how to configure the solaredge side of things and how to define the frequency control limits on the Victron, but I don't see where it describes how you program the Aux Relay (or K1) to do the dry contact...?

Thanks in Advance,

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pedaaa avatar image pedaaa commented ·

i have done it like this:

1673886019000.png


1673886020067.png


note:

you need to set 2x Relay Assistent. one for switching the relay ON, one for switching it OFF.

The shown configuration works for the blue AUX-Relay at the Multiplus II

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1673886020067.png (238.0 KiB)
7hvn avatar image 7hvn pedaaa commented ·

Thanks for sharing that detail! Quite surprised that this is missing from the documentation.


I think I have a slightly different use case for the off though which I will have to see if I can perform. Rather than a straight 'when AC1 not available for 0 seconds' I need:

Set Relay On when:

  • When AC1 not available for 0 seconds
  • AND
  • When batteries are fully charged

This should, I think, stop the ACOut1 connected SolarEdge from overcharging the batteries.

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